And under most trade iterations they'd still have Brown and Nets 18 that they could trade next year if they think they're one piece away from a title contender. They aren't emptying the war chest to go all in with Horford/IT/Butler.
Celtics Trade Deadline Game Thread
- Thread starter RedOctober3829
- Start date
I wonder if it would work in reverse for me if a trade happens since I started at acceptance.
Re: IT's sensitivity, it would strike me as insane and not very Ainge-like to trade BK17 just because a couple point guards are at/near the top of the board. Danny probably loves Jackson anyway.
Seeing some rumors about JaMychal Green this morning. He's probably the most exciting non-blockbuster name I've read. He's long, good rebounder, and can space the floor and shoot the three. Would look nice playing next to Horford. No idea what Memphis would want for him, though.
Potentially a rental as a RFA, though Memphis would undoubtedly try to get a return as if the acquiring team were keeping him long term. Tough to thread that needle.
The Obie teams didn't just fall apart on their own, they were dismantled purposefully. Maybe because they were "fool's gold" and didn't have a real title chance, but it's not like the core just stopped playing well all of a sudden (yes, Walker proved himself to be an inefficient chucker, but he was that anyway, it's just that Pitino leaving and Pierce being the better offensive player got him less focus so his box score started showing it more). And yeah, it's too bad they traded Joe Johnson to bolster that 2002 team, but, bear in mind that with the same essential core, they showed a bunch of improvement after ditching Pitino, and the team was in a bad place after the Pitino years anyway. With hindsight you soldier on with what you have, sure, but without it, I make that trade every time. (Too bad the Suns weren't high on Kedrick Brown instead though, right?)
As for this year, I am and was fine with standing pat. They are basically playing as expected. If Durant had come here or if Brown had been an instant All-Star I would agree about pushing harder to improve in the right now but I don't think there is any need to pay an inflated price just to get something done because Love's injury makes the Cavs more vulnerable.
As for this year, I am and was fine with standing pat. They are basically playing as expected. If Durant had come here or if Brown had been an instant All-Star I would agree about pushing harder to improve in the right now but I don't think there is any need to pay an inflated price just to get something done because Love's injury makes the Cavs more vulnerable.
My biggest fear w/r/t staying pat and drafting the Nets picks is that the players picked turn out to be overhyped. Then, all the Celtics are stuck with is a bunch of middle of the road to slightly above average players, making the playoffs, and flaming out. Basically a version of the Atlanta Hawks.
I don't think we necessarily need a top-10 guy to become a contender. Where were Truth, KG and Ray in the NBA hierarchy when they were acquired? KG was coming off a relatively down year at age 30 (based on all the advanced stats I've seen), Ray was over 30 with serious injury concerns and Truth had never really been considered a top-10 guy in the league his whole career.
RealGMVerified account@RealGM 2m2 minutes ago
Woj: I don't know if it would shock me if Paul George or Jimmy Butler were to move but I'd still be a little surprised.
Woj: I don't know if it would shock me if Paul George or Jimmy Butler were to move but I'd still be a little surprised.
And end up with Ball or Jackson? I'm happy with that. 4th pick is more of a dropoff imo.
This is wild. Do you remember KG? Comfortably top 10, while Pierce was comfortably top 20 and Ray was the best shooter in the league.
Yeah, I think KG was at the bottom of the top ten and Pierce was somewhere in the 10-15 range. Garnett, in particular, was a guaranteed 22-12-4 while maybe the league's best defensive player. Pierce was a legitimate number one option on offense, as well as an above average defensive wing.
What made that team great, though, was just how well they all fit together.
Seriously. This is like debating whether Duncan was a top 10 player.
Going off RAPM in 2007 (the year before they acquired KG), Garnett was 4th in the league, just behind LeBron, while Pierce was 15th.
Apparently Windhorst said on SC this morning that Gallinari is a potential back-up plan if Danny doesn't land George or Butler. No thank you.
The Cavs have been successful in the playoffs in spite of Love, not because of him. He missed most of their 2015 playoff run with an injury, and by last year's Finals he was stapled to the bench for much of the game, as the Cavs' best lineup had LBJ at the 4 and Tristan Thompson at the 5. They'd be a better team if they had kept the pick and drafted Wiggins, then used their money and other assets (some rebuilding team would've parted with a rotation player to wish on a star with Anthony Bennett at that point) to add a veteran or two, including a 4 to play Love's minutes.
Maybe Wiggins hasn't been as good as you'd hope a #1 overall pick would be, but by last season he would've been the Cavs' best wing besides LBJ. If you traded him now, you could get someone better than Kevin Love for him.
mike fisher ✭
@fishsports
ALERT: #Celtics + #Mavs in trade conversations today re #AndrewBogut source tells http://DallasBasketball.com
@fishsportsALERT: #Celtics + #Mavs in trade conversations today re #AndrewBogut source tells http://DallasBasketball.com
Interesting -
Keith SmithVerified account@KeithSmithNBA 54s55 seconds ago
Sources: BOS has received interest in Draft Rights to Ante Zizic, but have rebuffed all. Would only include him in a trade for a star now.
Keith SmithVerified account@KeithSmithNBA 54s55 seconds ago
Sources: BOS has received interest in Draft Rights to Ante Zizic, but have rebuffed all. Would only include him in a trade for a star now.
Someone check on Dejesus.
In all seriousness, it's low upside and low risk and adds some size. Throw them a second and be done with it.
In all seriousness, it's low upside and low risk and adds some size. Throw them a second and be done with it.
I'm not surprised. Given uncertainty around Amir, Zeller, and Kelly, The Celtics probably have Zizic pencilled in as Horford's backup next year.
In the NBA you're going to need some luck to win a title. The flip side is they could trade both picks for Paul George and still lose in the 2nd round, he could leave for the Lakers in a year and a half, and the Pacers could get Fultz who turns into a star. There's tons of risk on both sides.
Giving up valuable pieces for the honor of flaming out in The Finals and calling it progress is a dumb way to build an organization. Really hope they keep the picks and take the long view.
On the other hand, it's how they view IT. Do they think his play this year is a short term fluke or not? Are they building around him or not? I guess we'll find out today.
On the other hand, it's how they view IT. Do they think his play this year is a short term fluke or not? Are they building around him or not? I guess we'll find out today.
If Bogut comes our way it has to be Zeller going to Dallas right? And a 2nd? Have to cut someone, and James Young has been playing more minutes than Zeller due to injuries the past two weeks.
Seems like a pretty decent way to build an organization. If you can assemble the pieces to become the 2nd best team in the league, you take your chances in the finals.
I've been going back and forth on this whole trade deadline scenario and at the end of it I think they should do nothing.
Even if you add George or Butler, you're giving up a lot of assets to do so. I also don't think those acquisitions make you better than Cleveland or GSW, especially this year. If you mortgage the future for a current star that doesn't get you over that hump, your team is going to be in an even worse position for the future.
I would prefer trying to make a run at a high profile FA next year or the year after, and use the two Nets picks which will most likely be #'s 1-4 in both drafts. The Nets will be terrible next year too.
The only trade I would have liked to see Boston make was for Cousins. He may be a total headcase, but he was the exact positional player this team had the greatest need for. Keep in mind he was also part of a team that was the equivalent of the Cleveland Browns of the NBA. He also cost a lot less asset wise than Butler or George.
Anyway, here's to hoping the C's stand pat and get to draft some more young players to develop with Jaylen Brown and have an exceptional team in the next 3 years.
Even if you add George or Butler, you're giving up a lot of assets to do so. I also don't think those acquisitions make you better than Cleveland or GSW, especially this year. If you mortgage the future for a current star that doesn't get you over that hump, your team is going to be in an even worse position for the future.
I would prefer trying to make a run at a high profile FA next year or the year after, and use the two Nets picks which will most likely be #'s 1-4 in both drafts. The Nets will be terrible next year too.
The only trade I would have liked to see Boston make was for Cousins. He may be a total headcase, but he was the exact positional player this team had the greatest need for. Keep in mind he was also part of a team that was the equivalent of the Cleveland Browns of the NBA. He also cost a lot less asset wise than Butler or George.
Anyway, here's to hoping the C's stand pat and get to draft some more young players to develop with Jaylen Brown and have an exceptional team in the next 3 years.
Plus KG was correctly seen as a warrior that raised the intensity of his team. Is there a veteran guy right now, other than Lebron obviously, you would want more than the KG that was traded to the Celtics? Westbrook, KD, Curry. There are some younger guys sure, but as vet joining a team it doesn't get much better. I am still disappointed they won only one title.
Why not? No idea what the Nuggets are asking, but Gallo when healthy is a great, uber-versatile player who seems born to play for Brad Stevens.
Yeah, the "when healthy" asterisk gives pause if you're talking about a long-term deal, but he's an expiring contract. If he's healthy come playoff time, he significantly increases the Cs' "puncher's chances" against the Cavs.
Yes, as long as our Brooklyn picks turn into Durant and Westbrook, we should be ok.
He's a great scorer at the 4 but his lack of rebounding and mediocre defense doesn't seem like a great fit on this team to me.
I know this is a joke, but OKC had Durant and Westbrook for 8 years and didn't win a title. Winning a title is hard.
Adrian WojnarowskiVerified account@WojVerticalNBA 1m1 minute ago
Sources: Boston, Indy had preliminary talk on Paul George, but there won't be real dialogue until/unless C's introduce Nets pick into deal.
Sources: Boston, Indy had preliminary talk on Paul George, but there won't be real dialogue until/unless C's introduce Nets pick into deal.
Woj reporting the Pacers want something back for Paul George; won't just trade him for Amir Johnson's expiring contract.
Tweet already posted. Guess the question is whether or not Danny will cave at 2:50. I bet that if George is really on the table Danny throws in the pick.
Yup, which is precisely my point. Some people see these draft picks and assume the best case scenario for each one. I mean, I get not wanting to overpay for Butler or George but this whole wait for the future when we are The Awesome is a little much for me.
This Celtics team is built to win now. Our only all-star may not be an all-star calibre player in a few years. Horford is solid but is on the back 9 of his career. Bradley is probably not going to be resigned. This team is likely to look very different in 2-3 years. If you can get Butler or George while only sacrificing 1 Brooklyn pick, you're not mortgaging the future.
If the cost for those guys is 2 Nets picks or 1 Nets pick and Jaylen+, then I understand staying pat. But there is some definite risk with doing so.
So let's say you trade BKN 17, Smart, and Brown for PG13. That's probably what it would take to land him.
2017 Indy picks Ball or Fultz to pair with Turner, Brown, and Smart. If they are in the lottery in 2018, they draft a PF. If they could attract veteran FA's with that core, you might have just created a team that's better than your own.
Edit: Don't forget George can just walk away in like 1.5 years. He's from LA. It just seems like a bad idea.
WHOAH
Adrian WojnarowskiVerified account@WojVerticalNBA 11s12 seconds ago
Update on Boston, Indy: Boston hasn't met Indiana's asking price on Paul George, but Nets pick has entered conversation now, sources say.
Adrian WojnarowskiVerified account@WojVerticalNBA 11s12 seconds ago
Update on Boston, Indy: Boston hasn't met Indiana's asking price on Paul George, but Nets pick has entered conversation now, sources say.
Zach LoweVerified account@ZachLowe_NBA 21s22 seconds ago
Zach Lowe Retweeted Adrian Wojnarowski
Have heard same -- specifically '17 Nets pick, per sources. So much posturing this time of year...
Zach Lowe Retweeted Adrian Wojnarowski
Have heard same -- specifically '17 Nets pick, per sources. So much posturing this time of year...