Well yeah, I mean, if we're only going to count the time period when they've been not very good, it's a pretty safe bet that you're not going to find a lot of great roster decisions. There's reasons why they've not been very good.
Pats sign JuJu Smith-Schuster
- Thread starter cshea
- Start date
Oh F that nonsense. Mac is Dan Marino compared to the putrid pile of vomit that’s been JuJu’s game this season.
Maybe we'll see what he can do when he starts running the right routes and actually holds onto the ball. Until then he is the corpse.
I’d say the same of all of our receivers. Meaning they can’t throw it to themselves.
Defending JuJu over Mac this season sure is a choice.
A terrible and dumb choice. But a choice.
I for one find it hard to believe that when it's Mac Jones throwing the ball, our receivers as a group look worse than when it was Tom Brady throwing the ball. What are the odds?!
Juju has been really bad through 3 games, and I'd say it's mostly on him. I also think that people are piling on to a silly extent because the offense is bad, and blaming a WR (or all WRs) is a lot easier than wondering why almost every passcatcher who has come in the last 3 years has been disappointing.
It's not just Brady vs. Mac. Hunter Henry has his moments, but he's not Gronk, an elite deep threat and red zone game changer. The current WR group really doesn't look all that different from the group that Brady had over his last 6-7 years here, but having the GOAT tight end completely changes things up and down the field.
Seriously. Gronk, Edelman and **James White** were all IMMENSELY better in the passing game than literally anyone on our current roster.
But yeah, it’s all Mac’s fault that JuJu sucks. For fucks sake.
But yeah, it’s all Mac’s fault that JuJu sucks. For fucks sake.
What stood out to me today was they felt confident enough to have two sideline routes to Juju on the last two 3rd downs the Pats faced, to try to ice the game, and he looked terrible on both. Maybe Mac threw the ball wrong, hard to tell, but he got all twisted around both times and gave himself no chance to catch the ball.
He looked legitimately decent with Mahomes at QB - this drop-off is surprising to my (very untrained) eye. (Kelce was probably a major factor too, drawing all those double teams)
He looked legitimately decent with Mahomes at QB - this drop-off is surprising to my (very untrained) eye. (Kelce was probably a major factor too, drawing all those double teams)
You're not wrong, but Scar is still feeling like the biggest difference.
Which is fucking CRAZY. Like, I actually know what a line coach does, and it's STILL fucking bizarre to me just how important he was to their run.
He looks like he's less than 100%, but also, I think he and Mac just never seem to be on the same page in terms of the route, where the throw will be etc. Maybe it was just that Mahomes mostly throws lasers and so Juju just ran whatever and Mahomes drilled him in the chest?
Somebody needs to study what that is all about. Like, with the science. Because I don’t fucking get it and I’ve been asking people for years and nobody else understands how that is possible either.
Maybe I'm just underrating Edelman, but I think he more than any other skill player in the Brady era was helped by playing with Tom. He was undoubtedly more versatile than anyone in the current group (and it's unlikely anyone on the roster gets a chance to equal his postseason accomplishments) due to his ability to play defense and special teams, but purely as a receiver, I just don't think he was materially better than what guys like Parker/Bourne/Juju (I'm bullish on the latter regaining some of his form, he wouldn't be the first free agent to struggle early) can do. It's somewhat of a shame that we never got to see him play very much without Brady, but I suspect if he'd left the Pats, he would've vanished pretty quickly. I also think he benefited greatly from playing with Gronk, who just opened up everything.
Fair point on White, although Stevenson caught 69 passes last year, which is right in line with what White averaged from 2015-2019 (63 per year, 71 per 17 games).
I agree 100% with KFP that after Brady, the difference is the O-line. I won't try to parse whether it's coaching, health, chemistry, personnel or simple execution, but no one (not even Brady) could make the offense look good when the line is this bad.
It appears so, but on the other hand, Juju was legitimately good last year, better than Meyers basically across the board.
BB’s pal Mike Lombardi often talks about self scouting in terms of knowing the talent on your own team. This normally comes up when he is ripping someone or talking about how good BB is at it. Letting Meyers walk seems like a bad job by Bill.
Honestly I think it was fine to let him walk. I liked Jakobi a lot... he wasn't really that great, he was an accumulator and generally trustworthy, but he didn't have much juice. The problem is more that Juju has not looked the same, the brought him in because they thought he had a better skillset to fit with Bourne, Parker and Thornton... he hasn't shown it yet.
The Juju over Meyers move looks bad because Juju has been bad, not because they are really missing Jakobi.
This is probably true but it's kind of fun to note that despite missing last week in concussion protocol, Meyers has more catches and more receiving yards than anyone on the Pats. And he's got as many TD catches as he did in his first 3 years in NE combined.
We’re seeing a good receiver in a familiar system getting thrown to by an NFL QB. Not surprised he’s doing well.
Gronk was better than Jules.
But…
With Jules but without Gronk, the Pats won SB 51.
With Gronk but without Jules, the Pats lost SB 52.
Just saying…
(Mostly, but not totally, kidding)
Jakobi looks good this year with the gravity Adams causes on the field. That’s what really elevates the secondary options. Same as the Gronk and Kelce points above.
Slowing down is why we're having this conversation in the first place.
Let's hope he turns things around.
In Bourne's third game with us he was 6/96.
Parker's third game was 5/156.
JuJu looks awful on the field. I hope it's a nagging injury that will fully heal soon.
Has anyone seen any film break down of him? I really haven't paid much attention to him when hes on the field. And, maybe I'm just not looking hard enough, but when he does get balls thrown his way, I dont see the great big pile of shit that everyone here is making him out to be.
The Pats reporters that I respect (Reiss, etc.) have been saying that his lack of snaps is alarming, and that he's been bad when he's gotten time (poor routes, etc).
I thought they would use him differently than they have to date. I think you will be at his best if they can get them in space, run more stuff over the middle for him, and possibly getting him involved in the run game with some sweeps. Someone posted yesterday that they seem to be using him as a clone of that isn't really who he is.
My uninformed is just that they liked Douglas so much in camp that they tried to push juju into something a bit different or generic. Since Douglas has not been impressive I do not see why if they can't try some of that stuff with Smith Schuster.
My uninformed is just that they liked Douglas so much in camp that they tried to push juju into something a bit different or generic. Since Douglas has not been impressive I do not see why if they can't try some of that stuff with Smith Schuster.
I kind of disagree about Douglas. I think he's been very impressive. He leads the team in yards per reception and seems like one of the few guys who can make a play with the ball in his hands on offense. They foolishly benched him in the Miami game after the fumble. They don't have the luxury of being able to bench guys for fumbling anymore and I think Douglas is clearly one of their more talented skill position players.
Douglas definitely has more juice than anyone else in the passing game. He ran a really nice route on that 15 yard out and should have drawn a major DPI flag later in the game. Clearly got interfered with and BB was pissed at the no call. Definitely a guy they need to keep giving more action to.
Last night Juju looked like a guy that we just signed on Wednesday. Guy has talent. I'm just hoping that something clicks with him and Mac at some point, because he's adding nothing.
I'm hoping his role is as the reliable 3rd down chain mover. I think his only catch yesterday was that 5 yard out to move the chains. Don't really have any designs on him being much more than that, which obviously isn't great value given the money but would at least provide the offense with something. Bourne, Douglas, and Parker appear to be the chunk yardage guys on the team. Hopefully Thornton can eventually join that group.
I hope JuJu gets it together, but it's not a great sign that both the Steelers and the Chiefs were fine with him leaving. The Steelers in particular seem to have a knack for drafting WR talent and recognizing which ones are special and which ones are fungible.
62% snap percentage. 7% below his previous low. I'd imagine what they're seeing in practice is translating to his reduced usage, or perhaps it's mainly due to a crowded room filled with redundant skills.
He did play a season-high 71% yesterday to frankly pathetic results.
He did play a season-high 71% yesterday to frankly pathetic results.
He's on pace for 374 receiving yards over a full 17 game season. His long catch is for 15 yards. He has fewer receiving yards than Jonnu Smith has as the #2 TE in a run-heavy offense with a terrible QB in Ridder. Pretty much everyone who watches the Pats notes the lack of explosion, including literally the trained doctors on this site like rad, and those with scouting chops like SMU.
I'm pretty pessimistic and wouldn't be surprised if Boutte eventually takes his place. Whatever is going on with Boutte is probably JuJu's saving grace at the moment.
I definitely question a lot of belichicks judgement, usually in the gm role, but his idea of how to handle young guys fumbling is one I'd totally defer to. the pats have generally had pretty solid fumbling results, I trust his coaching there.
I don't think this current iteration of the Patriots has the luxury of benching a player due to a fumble for 3 quarters of a game. It's easier for Bill to do it when they've got Brady at the helm and guys like Edelman, Gronk, Amendola, James White at the skill positions. Sure, go ahead, teach a lesson and pound ball security into their head.
This is probably an indictment on the state of the offense more than anything but Douglas has shown he can get open and make plays. He's been arguably their second best WR on the year. He leads in yards per reception and is 2nd in success rate (tied with Parker). Pulling him off the field to teach him a lesson is also tying a hand behind the back of an otherwise already limited offense.
Completely agree with this take; moreover, as has been pointed out, Douglas continued to return punts that game, which is inherently more high-risk than holding onto the ball after a reception.