The Future of Alex Cora in Boston

[RedOctober3829]

I haven't seen sources implying this is how things went; do you have one or is this supposition?

How could anyone take it any other way? He had arm issues going back to Colorado, played 2nd base in Boston due to Bogaerts but it was easier on his arm and he was a better defender because of it, then got hurt ramping up his throwing in late December getting ready to play shortstop.

 

[joe dokes]

That's the problem here though. The players here were all complete question marks whether health related or defensive prowess. Duvall is a corner outfielder playing out of position in center. Acquiring an oft-injured in Mondesi who on top of the ACL injury had trouble staying on the field in prior years. They knew Story had issues with his elbow to the point that he had to play 2nd base so when asked to play SS he immediately gets hurt again trying to get his arm ready. These issues should not have been a surprise to anyone.

I was responding to Duvall being "poor outfielder." Not really. In CF or anywhere else in the past. (If I'm missing something that says Duval was a bad OF -- or a bad CF -- in the past, show me. I haven't found it.

Or Hernandez (not poor at SS or anywhere else). Again -- show me because I can't find it.
Absent something that suggests that the bolded was true in, say January, those really aren't question marks in any legitimate sense of the word.

Mondesi was a risk, so they got Chang in ST, who was doing the defense job that Hernandez could not do, until Chang got hurt.
As for Story, I am inclined to believe that getting ready for SS pushed his elbow. But I am also inclined to believe the reports that finally getting it fixed will get it fixed.

 

[RedOctober3829]

I was responding to Duvall being "poor outfielder." Not really. In CF or anywhere else in the past. (If I'm missing something that says Duval was a bad OF -- or a bad CF -- in the past, show me. I haven't found it.

Or Hernandez (not poor at SS or anywhere else). Again -- show me because I can't find it.
Absent something that suggests that the bolded was true in, say January, those really aren't question marks in any legitimate sense of the word.

Mondesi was a risk, so they got Chang in ST, who was doing the defense job that Hernandez could not do, until Chang got hurt.
As for Story, I am inclined to believe that getting ready for SS pushed his elbow. But I am also inclined to believe the reports that finally getting it fixed will get it fixed.

I didn't say that Duvall was a bad OFer. I said he was playing out of position in center field. In LF and RF, he had a combined 55 DRS in over 5000 innings. In CF he's a plus-2 in 750 innings. Therefore, he's a much better corner OFer but they shoehorned him into center field because Hernandez had to play SS.

 

[joe dokes]

I didn't say that Duvall was a bad OFer. I said he was playing out of position in center field. In LF and RF, he had a combined 55 DRS in over 5000 innings. In CF he's a plus-2 in 750 innings. Therefore, he's a much better corner OFer but they shoehorned him into center field because Hernandez had to play SS.

Bloom knew the shift ban was coming and still made Kike Hernandez his shortstop. He put a player in center field in Duvall who is a very poor CFer. Yoshida is a below average defender. He relied on an oft-injured utility player in Arroyo to man 2nd base. Valdez was absolutely brutal in his place. Casas is clearly not ready to play quality defense. The only above average defensive players on the field are Verdugo and Wong. He knowingly put a team on the field that had defensive issues all over. There's no excuses for how bad they are.

 

[RedOctober3829]

RedOctober3829 said:
Bloom knew the shift ban was coming and still made Kike Hernandez his shortstop. He put a player in center field in Duvall who is a very poor CFer. Yoshida is a below average defender. He relied on an oft-injured utility player in Arroyo to man 2nd base. Valdez was absolutely brutal in his place. Casas is clearly not ready to play quality defense. The only above average defensive players on the field are Verdugo and Wong. He knowingly put a team on the field that had defensive issues all over. There's no excuses for how bad they are.

Boom you got me. I looked his numbers up. Do you still want him being your every day center fielder?

 

[Red(s)HawksFan]

Boom you got me. I looked his numbers up. Do you still want him being your every day center fielder?

He's not going to hurt them as the everyday center fielder. I believe the concern this winter when he was signed to be the center fielder wasn't that he couldn't field the position reasonably well, it was whether he'd hold up to the rigors of doing it every day. He himself said he thought it was a more physically taxing position than the corners, but was up to the challenge. Of course, he went and broke his wrist on a freak play a week into the season so questions of endurance kinda went to the back burner.

 

[joe dokes]

Boom you got me. I looked his numbers up. Do you still want him being your every day center fielder?

Now that *his* defense appears to have reached major league caliber, Duran is making a case to play everyday. But they do need Duvall's (presently theoretical) RH pop.
But what to do now is a different question that how it looked in January when many of us (me, too) figured Duran was pretty close to trade throw-in territory.

 

[Max Power]

Boom you got me. I looked his numbers up. Do you still want him being your every day center fielder?

If he's hitting? Sure, why not?

These complaint threads whenever the team goes on a bad streak always focus on the defense, because that's something people feel like they can blame the coaching staff for. But the real problem is the offense. Devers has disappeared, Duvall is just starting to come around, Yoshida has slumped, Wong has been a strikeout machine, and the Blizzard has been completely useless. They can pitch and defend exactly as they've been recently (last night excepted) as long as they score runs. They're not doing enough of that now.

 

[RedOctober3829]

If he's hitting? Sure, why not?

These complaint threads whenever the team goes on a bad streak always focus on the defense, because that's something people feel like they can blame the coaching staff for. But the real problem is the offense. Devers has disappeared, Duvall is just starting to come around, Yoshida has slumped, Wong has been a strikeout machine, and the Blizzard has been completely useless. They can pitch and defend exactly as they've been recently (last night excepted) as long as they score runs. They're not doing enough of that now.

The problem is that the offensive production from earlier in the year was not sustainable. Now it shouldn’t be this bad but a regression should have been expected. Something that can be sustainable is having a good defensive team. However every aspect of this team is not consistent which is why they’re a .500 team.

 

[Paveskovich's Pole]

Edit: I'm sorry for using the word groomed. I know that's a bad form in these times. If this post needs to be erased I understand.

As in Jay "Hey pal, don't call me Buddy!" Groome?

 

[Auger34]

If you’re defending Bloom tooth and nail, I don’t understand how you could possibly think that Cora should be fired.

 

[nvalvo]

I have no particular attachment to Alex Cora, but I think we tend to underrate the insanity of the very specific job he has in this market. But I think he handles the media relationships pretty well and protects his players in a way that is easy to ignore until you suddenly have Bobby Valentine trashing Youkilis in the press in April 2012.

 

[Petagine in a Bottle]

I have no particular attachment to Alex Cora, but I think we tend to underrate the insanity of the very specific job he has in this market. But I think he handles the media relationships pretty well and protects his players in a way that is easy to ignore until you suddenly have Bobby Valentine trashing Youkilis in the press in April 2012.

The Bobby V Red Sox were 42-38 at this point in 2012, FWIW.

 

[Seels]

Cora probably isn't bad enough to fire until his team is better.

Problem is he's not good enough to have taken back after the suspension.

 

[Petagine in a Bottle]

Cora probably isn't bad enough to fire until his team is better.

Problem is he's not good enough to have taken back after the suspension.

Managed the team to within two games of the WS.

 

[8slim]

I have no particular attachment to Alex Cora, but I think we tend to underrate the insanity of the very specific job he has in this market. But I think he handles the media relationships pretty well and protects his players in a way that is easy to ignore until you suddenly have Bobby Valentine trashing Youkilis in the press in April 2012.

Agreed. Look, Joe Torre was not some kind of genius in-game manager. But he was very good at managing the locker room in an absurdly crazy NYC media environment. He was the very definition of a mediocre manager for FOURTEEN years before took over the Yankees.

 

[nvalvo]

The Bobby V Red Sox were 42-38 at this point in 2012, FWIW.

And they'd only win 27 more.

 

[Rovin Romine]

Agreed. Look, Joe Torre was not some kind of genius in-game manager. But he was very good at managing the locker room in an absurdly crazy NYC media environment. He was the very definition of a mediocre manager for FOURTEEN years before took over the Yankees.

If the argument is "Alex Cora is our very own Joe Torre" I think I'll just throw up in my mouth.

 

[Auger34]

Cora probably isn't bad enough to fire until his team is better.

Problem is he's not good enough to have taken back after the suspension.

So he’s Chaim Bloom as a manager? Again, it’s fucking insane that posters stick up for Bloom no matter what and then shit on Cora

 

[Max Power]

If you’re defending Bloom tooth and nail, I don’t understand how you could possibly think that Cora should be fired.

If you think Bloom did a great job of building a roster, then maybe you blame Cora for it underperforming. I don't see any logical inconsistency there.

 

[Rovin Romine]

If you think Bloom did a great job of building a roster, then maybe you blame Cora for it underperforming. I don't see any logical inconsistency there.

Maybe his whatabouting will work on the third try?