Random fact that is blowing my mind: SGA is the OLDEST player in OKC’s 8 man rotation. SGA is also 4 months younger than Jason Tatum. Tatum is the YOUNGEST player in Boston’s 8 man rotation. I don’t know what to make of that.
2023-2024 General NBA Season Thread
- Thread starter BigSoxFan
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One funny re their ages:
- everyone is so excited for SGA's bright future, and what he might do once he's finally in the playoffs again
- everyone thinks Tatum is a choker whose chances have come and gone
They're the same age!!
Sports narratives are really funny when they take hold. Loath as I am to defend Embiid, it's made me laugh to hear people describe him as a playoff choker because he's never made it out of the 2nd round, then in the next breath praise Dame Lillard as one of the most clutch players of his generation, despite Lillard being 4 years older and having exactly as many conference finals wins as Embiid (0).
I will probably go to my grave believing that Doc’s first year in Orlando, on a team that was discussed as possibly breaking the Sixers 9-73 record, to be .500 and win COY is the greatest pure coaching job in the history of the game. They had something like 5 Undrafted rookie FA in the rotation with Darrell Armstrong and Pat Garrity as their 1-2 “punch.”
Edit: Not Garrity…..Ron Freakin Mercer!
Hopefully they can draw the Heat and beat the crap out of each other before we have to play either one.
Isn’t the rap on Doc now that he spends more of his focus on getting tee times at Riviera instead of coaching? I’m not sure what his Orlando or Boston experience has to do with his recent record now that its a decade + in the past - he’s more celebrity than coach at this point, and his last two stops were more notable for how dysfunctional the teams were vs. their overachievement.
He’s better than Adrian Griffin, which is the only thing that matters, but for a guy who has a rep as a leader of men instead of Xs and Os, he sure has a long trail player beefs in his wake. And to move off of Bud because he doesn’t make adjustments only to end up with the guy who famously flames out every post season because he doesn’t make adjustments… I’m skeptical this works out.
He’s better than Adrian Griffin, which is the only thing that matters, but for a guy who has a rep as a leader of men instead of Xs and Os, he sure has a long trail player beefs in his wake. And to move off of Bud because he doesn’t make adjustments only to end up with the guy who famously flames out every post season because he doesn’t make adjustments… I’m skeptical this works out.
I get why they had to move on from Bud, optically and (most importantly) because of Giannis.
But a number of people said at the time the next guy probably wouldn't be as good a coach as Bud, and know we know that is true. And I'm willing to bet Doc is worse there than Bud was as well.
But a number of people said at the time the next guy probably wouldn't be as good a coach as Bud, and know we know that is true. And I'm willing to bet Doc is worse there than Bud was as well.
Giving the unfortunate likelihood of hating Rozier in the near and medium future, I'll look back with a smile now at this moment:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MA9uj5rDarg
I believe that's the only time I've heard Rob Williams referred to as "Bob."
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MA9uj5rDarg
I believe that's the only time I've heard Rob Williams referred to as "Bob."
I doubt it works out bc in the playoffs the Bucks have a whole slew of teams to get past and every one of them defends better. That’s a personnel issue not a Doc one.
https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/274402/Deandre-Ayton-Says-He-Has-Nothing-To-Prove
Good grief, maximum headache.
Good grief, maximum headache.
He's not mentioned among the massive busts of the last few years because he was a productive player for a title contender, but now he's just an average starter with little upside, making big money and playing for a bottom 6 team. If there were a 2018 redraft, I'm not sure he'd go in the lottery.
"You Shall Not Pass!" seems like a weird basketball coaching philosophy, though, unless you're coaching Kobe.
Anyway, Memphis is up double digits on the Heat. Are they really going to lose to a bad team, a night before getting us on full rest?
I think I'd prefer to see Miami miss the playoffs entirely even more than I'd like GS and LAL to miss out. It's basically impossible for them to not finish in the top 10 (hard to see them dropping below 8), but given the streak they went on last year, it'd be more than fitting for them to get dumped in the play in.
$32.5 this year, $34 next year, $35.6 in '25-26. Ouch. I guess he's got 170 million reasons not to get too fussed about any expectations placed on him.
That's kinda... wow, Giannis, YOU wanted this guy and then you proceed to act like this afterwards...?
Grizzlies are crapping on Heat Culture and softening them up for Boston tomorrow. Vince Williams is going to be a lot more well known in a few weeks.
Edit: Scary Terry 3-11 in his debut playing 28+ minutes.
Right? Some of these young players are showing out for Memphis. GG Jackson is another one. I’m interested in Pippen’s son now too.
I’d usually think this way, but their social media person posting it with the laughing emoji, seems relatively on the nose.
Plus, someone would have posted if that was their usual pregame thing by now.
Edit: nevermind lol
He feels like the end of an era. The last big man who wasn't supremely talented to go first overall. Size and athleticism aren't enough anymore, there's just too much skill.
View: https://twitter.com/WorldWideWob/status/1750342955477708871?s=20
I'll still laugh, but it's probably unrelated.
Hard to really care about a regular season loss, but Miami losing at home to Memphis is brutal. Memphis was missing 4 of their 5 projected starters, and the one guy that played (JJJ) was awful, shooting 5-21 from the field for just 15 points and 6 rebounds. Rozier with an unremarkable debut, 3-11 for 9 points, 5 assists and 3 steals in 29 minutes. The Rozier/Herro backcourt will have problems defending a couple teams.
I was bummed when Marcus got hurt because this group plus him plays exactly the way you would think they would. They are annoying and relentless - JJJ embodies this too imo. They are a problem for good teams who get engaged in close ones down the stretch. It kind of makes you wonder how this would all look with a healthy, locked-in Ja.
There was a lot of rumors about Celtics and GG Jackson heading into the draft, so I researched up on him. Super young, but has legitimate upside.
Rozier took a 3 that would've given them the lead, down 98-96, but missed. The Heat went cold from that point forward. Jimmy Butler was not exactly "him" all night either, 4 for 10 for 15 points (and 4 turnovers) in 35 minutes.
Jimmy is having his worst season in a long time, so far. I’ve learned to never write the Heat off, but he always puts up monster advanced stats, despite people thinking he doesn’t bring it in the regular season. This season? Meh.
If he isn’t substantially better in the playoffs, they’ll get wrecked by any of the contenders.
DARKO was never as high on him as the other highly regarded advanced stats. EPM, LEBRON, even BPM (not as highly regarded as the others lol, but box score based) all have him way behind the last few seasons. He’s been top 5-10 in the those three for the last four years or so. This year he’s 40th in EPM, 56th in LEBRON, and 33rd in BPM.
His BPM the previous four years was 7.1, this year he’s at 3.2. There’s been a pretty noticeable drop off, as of this point.
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Not the greatest look after the firing, but if it's routine, then meh.
So naturally they'll come out with something to prove tomorrow night right?
Yea he is having a down year compared to only last year (his best season of his career). This year may be his 2nd best. He is a beast still, and is in no way having his "worst season in a long time"
He’s absolutely having his worst season in a long time, unless you don’t consider five years a long time.
Show me any statistical measure that shows this being anywhere close to his second best season.
Heat are now 24-20 w/ this strech coming up before the trade deadline: Celtics tomorrow night, @NYK , PHX, SAC, @WAS (reprieve), LAC, ORL, SA (reprieve pt. 2), BOS, @MIL, @PHI. Post deadline: @NOP, @SAC, @POR, @DEN to close out Feb. Very real chance they're ~.500 going into March and in a dog fight w/ Indy and Orlando for the 6 seed. I know they look like garbage rn but would prefer PHI or MIL have to deal with them in R1, so hoping they end up at 6 or 7.
He's averaging career highs in 3p% and FT%, adding up to the 2nd best TS% of his career (after last year). He's also averaging fewer fouls than he ever has, but pretty much everything else (points, rebounds, assists, steals) is down. He's been hurt a lot and they are just 15-14 when he does play, so it's hard to say if this is something he'll snap out of or if this is just who he is at age 34.
Butler has dropped off in EPM, probably a product of the assist rate being down, steal rate being down, and the rebounding being down (all relative to the last 5 years). He's also already missed 15 games and doesn't play in back to backs. That's not just an "availability is the best ability" argument. It's easier to be better in the games you do play when you don't play as many minutes/games because you aren't as tired, and he's not been better.
It could be a function of pacing himself for the playoffs. Or it could be he's starting to get to the other side of it in his age 34 season. I think the trade for Rozier indicates how Miami is thinking internally about this team. I'm sure they think they are title contenders, but from my perspective that move was about staying out of the play-in given what New York and Indiana have done. Prior to that move they were likely looking at the 7 seed. They may still be looking at the 7 seed. They've played a soft schedule and have scored 2 more points than they've allowed on the season.
It could be a function of pacing himself for the playoffs. Or it could be he's starting to get to the other side of it in his age 34 season. I think the trade for Rozier indicates how Miami is thinking internally about this team. I'm sure they think they are title contenders, but from my perspective that move was about staying out of the play-in given what New York and Indiana have done. Prior to that move they were likely looking at the 7 seed. They may still be looking at the 7 seed. They've played a soft schedule and have scored 2 more points than they've allowed on the season.
Butler from 2019-last season had an EPM of over 5, this year it’s 2.8. His LEBRON in that same time period was about 5, this season? It’s 2. Below, I’ll post his BPM from highest to lowest. He could absolutely turn it around, like I said, I’m not writing him off, but get out of here with the condescending shit. To this point in the season, he’s playing worse than he has in at least four seasons. Because of his age, it’s fair to wonder what level he will be going forward.
I'm not enjoying the NBA trying to make the Spurs and Thunder into a rivalry. I get why, but the Thunder are in 1st place, the Spurs in last, 23 games back. This isn't interesting.
Not saying firing the coach was a mistake, but that sure reads like why does the team that traded defense for offense now suck at defense. Definitely the coach's fault.
The schematic changes always looked dumb given the roster, and in retrospect (as benhogan and KOC pointed out) the Stotts interaction in pre-season also was weird. Seems like the likely conclusion is that Griffin was way over his head here. So whether or not someone else can fix it given the roster, still makes sense to move on. Whatever else is true of Doc, you know he won't be in over his head leading an NBA team
Wonder who in MIL's front office was the ghost-writer for this article.
I thought this quote - "Bucks players need to put in greater effort hustling back on defense, but one of Griffin’s schematic tweaks on offense has also led to more bleeding on the break. Griffin regularly has one of his wings or guards looking to crash the glass from the perimeter. If a Buck doesn’t secure the rebound, it leads to leak-outs and one fewer perimeter player trying to contain in transition." - was pretty amusing since this is what JMazz has asked the Cs to do and seems to be all the rage in the NBA (see this article that was posted in one or another thread in the past: https://theathletic.com/5064489/2023/11/16/nba-offensive-rebounds-corner-breakdown/).