#DFG: Canceling the Noise

[E5 Yaz]

Bedard with the bad timing prize
 
Who are these Patriots, and what have they done with the robots America loves to hate?
http://mmqb.si.com/2015/01/19/nfl-afc-championship-new-england-patriots-bill-belichick-tom-brady/

 

[loshjott]

So this story is important enough to be the second opener on the NBC Nightly News .... WTF?

Which network is airing the SB this year???

Deflate-debate-gate!!

 

[twibnotes]

If the NFL actually gets this investigation done within a week, it will be a Festivus miracle.

In a rare show of transparency, the NFL has actually release footage of the investigation

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7S3K9kEASOw

 

[MarcSullivaFan]

I gotta say, not a single Colts fan I know here in Indy has said anything to me about it or posted anything on FB. The only guy at work who said anything was a Packers fan. It's basically Kravitz and a few of the morons from the local news channels. Even the meathead drive-time radio guy on the ESPN affiliate said it was stupid.

 

[kenneycb]

In a rare show of transparency, the NFL has actually release footage of the investigation

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7S3K9kEASOw

Here's the report from another angle.
http://youtu.be/E9nr27rOrL0

 

[PaulinMyrBch]

Blandino just on the nfl network. Not much revealing other than to say they allow teams to supply balls so the team can practice with them during the week. Said balls change pressure based on conditions like weather and get taken out of circulation if official feels it's off. Said teams can't do anything to a ball after it's been inspected by officials and they'll look into it.

 

[DeJesus Built My Hotrod]

I gotta say, not a single Colts fan I know here in Indy has said anything to me about it or posted anything on FB. The only guy at work who said anything was a Packers fan. It's basically Kravitz and a few of the morons from the local news channels. Even the meathead drive-time radio guy on the ESPN affiliate said it was stupid.

 
The local sports radio drive-time show here in San Francisco was pretty dismissive of it as well but this is a pretty neutral town when it comes to the Patriots. I suspect this "story" will get more coverage/clicks back in New England and in cities where there is more of a natural rivalry with New England/Boston.   
 
But again, they are the Cheatriots and will always be to some segment of the NFL-following population.   There will be no convincing those people otherwise.

 

[jtn46]

The CBS evening news is covering this as an actual news story. The Patriots may have cheated their way to the Super Bowl. Absurd.

Edit: complete with a reference to taping team's practices.

That's more of a statement on how lousy network news is now. (It was probably the third story on ABC)

 

[Ed Hillel]

Misunderstood his quote maybe.
 

Said teams can't do anything to a ball after it's been inspected by officials and they'll look into it.

 
As in can't access them, or it's illegal to change them?

 

[riboflav]

Misunderstood his quote maybe.

 
I read it that way at first too. But, I think Paulin' meant that teams are not allowed to do anything to the balls post-inspection. Not that there is no way that they can doctor the balls.
 
EDIT: Hopefully, Paulin can clarify.

 

[twibnotes]

Trying to look at the positives:

- great motivator, not that they need it

- given the absurdity of the claim, maybe it's ultimately remembered as an example of how other teams and the media are so desperate and irrational when it comes to labeling the pats as cheaters

 

[GregHarris]

Less than 24 hours, and already had enough of psigate.

 

[TheoShmeo]

There is about 15 useful posts in this thread.

The Pats are battling at the top of the mountain, and SoSH has some of the best minds to discuss it. It would be awesome to see this topic wane while the more analytical ones grew.

Except people are interested in this topic.  And for obvious reasons.  For that reason, you can wish as much as you want but this thread will continue to grow rapidly.
 
I have trouble seeing the NFL being able to reach many firm conclusions about what the Pats were doing absent some smoking gun evidence.  As others (perhaps in your select 15 posts) have observed, determining much from balls after the fact seems like a tall order.
 
But given the allegations made in the past about the Pats, the fact that other fans continually call them the Cheatriots, the fact that nearly all of us Pats fans desperately want at least one Lombardi post-SpyGate, in part, to erase all this BS ("they never won a SB after they lost their video taping advantage...just saying"), and the fact that what the NFL might do in response to this latest wave of BS is uncertain, this will be a lively topic of discussion for a while.
 
I'm just glad it broke when it did and not, like Tomase's birth product, in the last days before the SB.  The timing, I believe will make it less of a distraction.

 

[Leather]

Thank God they won 45-7. I think that alone takes a lot of wind out of this to most rational people.

 

[PaulinMyrBch]

I meant its against rules to do it not that it's impossible

 

[Comfortably Lomb]

I really don't understand what the point of Kraft standing up for Goodell was over that whole woman beating is no big deal thing if the Pats don't get a favor here.

 

[Devizier]

 
Bedard with the bad timing prize
 
Who are these Patriots, and what have they done with the robots America loves to hate?
http://mmqb.si.com/2015/01/19/nfl-afc-championship-new-england-patriots-bill-belichick-tom-brady/
 

 
Cleatus is gone? Good fucking riddance.

 

[PaulinMyrBch]

Sorry was typing on my phone which isn't ideal. 
 
Blandino basically said that the ball pressure can change due to weather, and specifically mentioned, "like we had last night", then followed up to say they are looking into it. As if to imply they are looking into all things that could effect the pressure. So I'm assuming they feel a ball was not at 12.5 during the game, was taken out of play, and they are looking at all possibilities as to why, which include tampering and natural causes such as weather. That's how it sounded at least. 
 
In regards to the ball issue, once it passes inspection, its good for the game and the team and QB have had it all week to get it the way the QB and team likes for the game. Went on to say the reason for the kicking balls is that kickers and punters were over inflating them years ago and essentially changing the shape and hangtime, so they needed to make that ball uniform, but that the non kicking balls have never presented that problem.

 

[canderson]

The only just punishment here is to disband the Patriots, make BB coach a NAIA team and force Kraft to buy a WNBA team and have them play at Gillete.

 

[MarcSullivaFan]

The only just punishment here is to disband the Patriots, make BB coach a NAIA team and force Kraft to buy a WNBA team and have them play at Gillete.

Or force BB to become Jim Irsay's butler for a year.

 

[derrotehahn]

From section 1 of Rule 2 (The Ball)
 
 The Referee shall be the sole judge as to whether all balls offered for play comply with these specifications. A pump is to be
furnished by the home club, and the balls shall remain under the supervision of the Referee until they are delivered to the
ball attendant just prior to the start of the game. 
 
So, unless the referee violated the rules himeself, any tampering would have had to take place on the sideline, no? I would imagine that would be pretty difficult to pull off unnoticed with 70,000 people and a couple dozen cameras around.

 

[DJnVa]

BTW, don't kill the messenger on this -- Mike Freeman's the guy who wrote an article a few days ago about how people should let Spygate go.  

Freeman seems to be laughing at this. He's posting stuff about X-Files and Roswell.
 
 
 
And there's no reason this investigation should take any longer than it takes to check the pressure of the balls.

 

[DJnVa]

Bob Glauber from Newsday:
@BobGlauber: Important to note that at no point did Belichick deny the Patriots were using deflated footballs during game against Colts.

Is this...is this serious? I mean, two weeks of this nonsense still to come.

 
It's important to note that Bob Glauber has yet to deny he has stopped beating his wife.

 

[Kenny F'ing Powers]

Except people are interested in this topic.  And for obvious reasons.  For that reason, you can wish as much as you want but this thread will continue to grow rapidly.

Oh, I get it. Clickbait works. There's one tweet from a reporter, a few messages from the NFL stating they'll look into it, and here we are. Posters questioning the integrity of the NFL for not shutting this down swiftly, declaring the future of the NFL is bleak, people fearing for the legacy of Patriot coaches and players, and around, and around...

Nearly every other post is blasting the media for mindlessly following obvious talking points (and driving traffic), yet people can't help but chase the carrot despite the story having almost no legs. It's a rush to be offended, an unfortunately common practice nowadays.

I won't go as far as "New England fans are whiners". I get the frustration behind this. I don't necessarily blame people either. I've just lost my ability to give a shit about media driven storylines. In 25 years, people will look at this stretch as the greatest of all time. Spygate MAY be noted, but all this other shit? The formations, deflated balls, running up scores? It'll vanish into the ether. I have a hard time getting my blood pressure up over that shit.

 

[ColoradoJack]

This is all Ray Rice's fault.

 

[Salva135]

Comparing the Ray Rice situation or any off-field investigation of players to this is fruitless.   What players do off the field is reprehensible, but fans move past that damn quickly because it's off the field.   The Pats are allegedly attacking the very integrity of the game itself, and that's where the fans go ballistic.   For non-Ravens fans, Ray Rice is but a mere amusing sideshow.   This to them, however, is REAL.  

 

[DJnVa]

Jesus, this just hit the national news.  "Did the Patriots cheat their way into the Super Bowl?"

 
Listening to radio in car after work and the news at the top of the hour, which is some nationally produced thing, and in their 90 second update talks about 3 stories at most talked about this.

 

[DaughtersofDougMirabelli]

I know this story has gotten traction and people are freaking out, but I haven't heard one rational person actually believe this is a big deal.  Complete non-story. 
 
Trolls will run wild with this, everyone else couldn't give a damn. 

 

[DJnVa]

The NFL needs to squash this.

 
There's a part of me that wants the Pats to take a stand and do something like boycott media day. It's not like Kraft couldn't pay the fines.

 

[Bozo Texino]

Edit: Nevermind.  "Search this topic" is your friend.

 

[mikeot]

 
There's a part of me that wants the Pats to take a stand and do something like boycott media day. It's not like Kraft couldn't pay the fines.

 
That would be awesome. 

 

[8slim]

Oh, I get it. Clickbait works. There's one tweet from a reporter, a few messages from the NFL stating they'll look into it, and here we are. Posters questioning the integrity of the NFL for not shutting this down swiftly, declaring the future of the NFL is bleak, people fearing for the legacy of Patriot coaches and players, and around, and around...

Nearly every other post is blasting the media for mindlessly following obvious talking points (and driving traffic), yet people can't help but chase the carrot despite the story having almost no legs. It's a rush to be offended, an unfortunately common practice nowadays.

I won't go as far as "New England fans are whiners". I get the frustration behind this. I don't necessarily blame people either. I've just lost my ability to give a shit about media driven storylines. In 25 years, people will look at this stretch as the greatest of all time. Spygate MAY be noted, but all this other shit? The formations, deflated balls, running up scores? It'll vanish into the ether. I have a hard time getting my blood pressure up over that shit.

A topic like this is accessible. That's why it spawns such interest and throws off so many posts.

It's the difference between a government scandal involving sex vs. one involving complex financial transactions.

The heavy analytics topics won't suffer because of interest in this situation. I imagine you know that there is a ceiling on interest in the former.

 

[E5 Yaz]

Oh, I get it. Clickbait works. 

 
Now, if we can just give soxhop an intervention ... or an enema

 

[singaporesoxfan]

 
Now, if we can just give soxhop an intervention ... or an enema

With message board friends like these, who needs enemas?

 

[lexrageorge]

 
From section 1 of Rule 2 (The Ball)
 
 The Referee shall be the sole judge as to whether all balls offered for play comply with these specifications. A pump is to be
furnished by the home club, and the balls shall remain under the supervision of the Referee until they are delivered to the
ball attendant just prior to the start of the game. 
 
So, unless the referee violated the rules himeself, any tampering would have had to take place on the sideline, no? I would imagine that would be pretty difficult to pull off unnoticed with 70,000 people and a couple dozen cameras around.
 

Correct.  The referees release the balls to the ball attendants once the game is ready to begin.  Which means the only chance for tampering is to have some guy on the sideline somehow taking the air out of the balls.  I personally find the possibility of that happening to be extremely unlikely, never mind the stupidity of doing such an act in the first place.  
 
I guess it's possible that the referees don't test the balls with a pressure gauge, or perhaps only test one or two.  Maybe they just pick them up, see that they feel "right", and mark them as inspected.  

 

[E5 Yaz]

With message board friends like these, who needs enemas?

 
Barium at Wounded Knee

 

[soxhop411]

 
Now, if we can just give soxhop an intervention ... or an enema

My intention was not to make the title be click bait. I just thought this should have gotten it's own thread because we all know any "controversy" involving the patriots turns into a media frenzy. (See the Balt game)

 

[PaulinMyrBch]

One other point on Blandino, he never used the word investigation, just said they're looking into it.

 

[mostman]

This just got picked up by BGR. What's BGR you ask? It's a site that covers technology news - mostly mobile phone stuff. This is the first time I think I've ever seen a sports story of any kind on this site. For anyone arguing against the fact that the Patriots get harsher treatment over stories such as these, I'm not sure how to answer.

http://bgr.com/2015/01/19/new-england-patriots-deflategate-scandal/

 

[PayrodsFirstClutchHit]

This just got picked up by BGR. What's BGR you ask? It's a site that covers technology news - mostly mobile phone stuff. This is the first time I think I've ever seen a sports story of any kind on this site. For anyone arguing against the fact that the Patriots get harsher treatment over stories such as these, I'm not sure how to answer.

http://bgr.com/2015/01/19/new-england-patriots-deflategate-scandal/

 
I like this line...
 
All the same, ever since the Patriots got caught illegally videotaping their opponents’ defensive signals in 2007, the franchise has been under constant suspicion for cheating and is, along with the Dallas Cowboys, the most hated team in the NFL.

 

[geoduck no quahog]

Facts...we need facts.
 
What does an under-inflated ball do? It's easier to grip. How does that impact the accuracy of passing? Don't know. A harder ball probably flies more true. A softer ball is probably controlled better at release, but with less spin. What do you think it impacts most? Bringing the ball down prior to a sack or hit. Be interesting to know.
 
The only thing that matters is if the balls became softer after inspection. Assuming Brady likes a soft ball, let's say everything is inflated to 12.5 psi for him. It's inevitable that some balls might lose pressure (let's put it this way, they won't gain pressure unless they're put in an oven) during a game. The refs feel the ball and decide it's too soft and remove it from the game. Do they ever test that ball for pressure? How many do/did they remove? For which teams? How often during the season?
 
They can't "test" balls from yesterday's game. It's too late.
 
Teams get to fuck with their balls before every game. The only thing that "weight" responds to is if a team puts too much shit (resin, spittle, cum) on their balls before inspection, or if the balls were poorly manufactured.
 
As stated, the only thing that has wings here is if the Patriots ball boy deflated their balls after inspection. If that's the case, and it's provable, then the Pats deserve what they're getting. If not - then everyone should sftu.
 
Last fact: Adams is a whiny asshole. If the Pats had deflated their balls, it would have been apparent from the beginning of the game (and to the refs handling them), unless of course they figured out a way to code the deflation to only specific balls known only to the ball boy...possibly with special radioactive tracers that light up receivers planted into the ball boy's skull.
 
Other explanation. A ball or two felt too soft to the refs. They asked for them to be replaced. Adams jumped on this to the TV guy saying the Pats cheated.

 

[DJnVa]

OMG, it just hit me:  is it just a coincidence that the same guy intercepted passes and then "noticed" and "complained" both in game 11 and again last night about the deflation.  

 
Mike Adams didn't intercept the pass last night. D'Qwell Jackson did.

 

[GregHarris]

Wasn't the ball underthrown? If it's uninflated, it seemed to help the Colts on that play.

 

[dcmissle]

Chuck Pagano:

"I did not notice deflated footballs, and it is not my place to comment on it."

That is via PFT. And that is an individual not about to embarrass himself after enormous spanking

History repeats itself as farce. That is where we are.

 

[DJnVa]

NFLN is replaying the game. They just showed the part where the ball was changed out before the Pats drive. If the refs were reacting to some complaint that the balls on the Pats sideline were being fucked with, why the hell would they call the ballboy on that sideline over, get a new ball from him, and give him the one they took out of the game?
 
 
"Hey look, the Colts think someone on Pats sideline is fucking with these balls."
"Shit, let's change it out. What should we do with it?"
"Just get a new one from that guy on the Pats sideline and give him this one."
"But....."
 
Or possibly, Mike Carey was right for the first time and they simply forgot to put in a regular ball after kickoff or they wanted a ball that wasn't quite as wet.
 
 
 

Chuck Pagano:

"I did not notice deflated footballs, and it is not my place to comment on it."
 

 
And one would think if there actually was a complaint from Colts sideline it would have to come from Pagano.
 
Of course, reading that quote, it doesn't say he didn't report that his players noticed it. Which should be the question he was asked, "You didn't notice any, but did your sideline lodge an in game complaint?"

 

[DennyDoyle'sBoil]

One thing I seem to remember from that sequence is that Anderson waited a bit and was ready to go because the ball boy apparently wasn't around yet, and he waived them to just get on with it, but then the ball boy showed so they changed balls. So, Walt was ready to go with the "bad" ball if it was going to take much more time, so he couldn't have been too concerned.

 

[Stitch01]

There's a part of me that wants the Pats to take a stand and do something like boycott media day. It's not like Kraft couldn't pay the fines.

Actually had that thought because there's some Seahawks that are sick of the leagues bullshit starting with their running back. Just a media day with no one there would be fantastic.

 

[Hoya81]

Chuck Pagano:

"I did not notice deflated footballs, and it is not my place to comment on it."

That is via PFT. And that is an individual not about to embarrass himself after enormous spanking

History repeats itself as farce. That is where we are.

I'm wondering now if this was someone in the Colts front office who complained and got the brush off from the league and decided to leak it .

 

[EvilEmpire]

And what would widespread differences in inflation prove?

If all the balls for both teams were collected and the ones on the Patriot side were consistently difference (underinflated or whatever) than the ones the Colts used, that would be an indicator that maybe something was awry. A good reason to investigate more fully. The physical playing environment was the same for both teams and should have impacted the balls from both teams similarly.

Again, I doubt they did, because if they had, this nonsense would likely already be over. Looking at a couple of balls in isolation might not clarify anything. Look at them all at the same time and it should be pretty easy to see if something is different between the balls the two teams played with.

 

[Stitch01]

What about the fact, mentioned just a couple of times above, that each QB likes their balls to be rubbed and handled in a different way before the game?