#DFG: Canceling the Noise

[Leather]

Something like that happened to Pete Carroll, but that was the NCAA

 
No.  Carroll's team (USC) forfeited games in 2004-2006, the period in which infractions were alleged to have occurred.  The decision came in 2010.  The courts were not involved.
 
USC's punishment would be analogous to that...absurd scenario above if every game between 2004 and 2010 was vacated.

 

[mauidano]

Cossack backpedaling on ESPN.

 

[djbayko]

A big win for the NFLPA to be sure. But maybe the guy who gave away player rights regarding discipline in the last negotiations, should just shut the fuck up and take a measured approach to his end zone dance. What's the benefit of antagonizing now, if the goal is eventually to collectively arrive a more fair and reasonable process.(Apologies for not be able to imbed quotes from the article. Having Mobil device issues).


http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/09/03/de-smith-we-never-trust-the-nfl-kraft-shouldnt-have-either/

Is this true? I thought we had concluded that not much has changed since before Goodell...it's just that no commissioner had tried to abuse the CBA in this regard until recently?

 

[In Vino Vinatieri]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOFn8dWc1_g
 
I could have sworn that when Clemens was on the Yankees there were a bunch of ROOOOGERRRRRR ROOOOGERRRRRR chants riffing off the Darryl Strawberry ones, but in trying to find a clip of it all I've seen are people talking about chanting Darryl again in 1999 when he was also on the Yankees.
 
Either way, I'd love to hear this watching the game on TV. It's pretty much as Boston as it gets. It's kind of haunting because it works like a round, it's simple enough that everybody joins in, and these combine to make it audible over a broadcast. There's no way Cris Collinsworth can pull a "they're chanting, but who knows what they're saying, it's so loud here!!! ha ha ha" old man shtick -- everyone watching will know.
 
Also, let's face it, Roger might be able to put on a tough front but we'll all know he's shedding that single tear when he thinks nobody's looking.
 
Really looking forward to this.

 

[Omar's Wacky Neighbor]

Cossack AGAIN with the "what's to stop everyone who doesn't like the way their arbitration turned out, from taking it to court?"
 
(This is a joke, right?  He can't possibly be missing how this particular case is different.)

 

[SemperFidelisSox]

In Super Bowl 50, the REDACTED defeated the Cowboys 35-14 for their second consecutive championship and fifth in franchise history. REDACTED won his fourth Super Bowl MVP with 304 yards passing and three touchdowns. "It feel great to win again", said REDACTED.

 

[brandonchristensen]

TJ Ward suspended for "an altercation at a Denver strip club."
 
What a day.

He was trying to deflate his balls. Got carried away.
4 games.

 

[snowmanny]

 
No.  Carroll's team (USC) forfeited games in 2004-2006, the period in which infractions were alleged to have occurred.  The decision came in 2010.  The courts were not involved.

OK, true but they did lose a championship and I wanted to make fun of Pete Carroll.

 

[brandonchristensen]

In Super Bowl 50, the REDACTED defeated the Cowboys 35-14 for their second consecutive championship and fifth in franchise history. REDACTED won his fourth Super Bowl MVP with 304 yards passing and three touchdowns. "It feel great to win again", said REDACTED.

 
EXPLETIVE DELETED

 

[epraz]

A big win for the NFLPA to be sure. But maybe the guy who gave away player rights regarding discipline in the last negotiations, should just shut the fuck up and take a measured approach to his end zone dance. What's the benefit of antagonizing now, if the goal is eventually to collectively arrive a more fair and reasonable process.(Apologies for not be able to imbed quotes from the article. Having Mobil device issues).


http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/09/03/de-smith-we-never-trust-the-nfl-kraft-shouldnt-have-either/

 
The NFLPA didn't "give away" player rights regarding discipline in the last negotiations.  They started from this position, included a revamped discipline system as a bargaining point, and gave it up, presumably in return for something else.  Goodell had this power in 2009,.

 

[GregHarris]

Ran some hastily derived numbers based on flawed assumptions and came up with $10.00 to $12.00 per seat from the season ticket holders going to fund the Wells Report.   When do we get refunded?

 

[Stitch01]

Here is my concern.
Tom plays this season.
The league appeals and eventually wins.
Maybe even after we win another Superbowl.
 
The league makes the Patriots forfeit the games Tom has played in.
 
If there is a chance this could happen I wouldn't set foot on the field unless the league agrees to not make them forfeit any games.

Honestly cant tell if this is the new low for hot takes or half decent mockery.

 

[dcmissle]

Cossack AGAIN with the "what's to stop everyone who doesn't like the way their arbitration turned out, from taking it to court?"
 
(This is a joke, right?  He can't possibly be missing how this particular case is different.)

They are terribly embarrassed. Cossack especially . He lacks the legal chops for this.

ESPN = Fox on election night in 2012.

That is not a political statement. It's what happens when your skewed view of things comes up against harsh reality in the early morning sky.

 

[dcmissle]

The NFLN will fuck me tonight, however. I was hoping for some out-of-town snippets from game 4 tonight, maybe a little live action. Good luck with that.

 

[BigPapiLumber Co.]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOFn8dWc1_g
 
I could have sworn that when Clemens was on the Yankees there were a bunch of ROOOOGERRRRRR ROOOOGERRRRRR chants riffing off the Darryl Strawberry ones, but in trying to find a clip of it all I've seen are people talking about chanting Darryl again in 1999 when he was also on the Yankees.
 
Either way, I'd love to hear this watching the game on TV. It's pretty much as Boston as it gets. It's kind of haunting because it works like a round, it's simple enough that everybody joins in, and these combine to make it audible over a broadcast. There's no way Cris Collinsworth can pull a "they're chanting, but who knows what they're saying, it's so loud here!!! ha ha ha" old man shtick -- everyone watching will know.
 
Also, let's face it, Roger might be able to put on a tough front but we'll all know he's shedding that single tear when he thinks nobody's looking.
 
Really looking forward to this.

 
1999 ALCS Game 3.  "Where is Roger?" "In the shower!"
 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1999_American_League_Championship_Series
 
I can't embed, and I'm at work so I can't direct to what time it starts, but the 3rd/4th innings would be a good place to start.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZbGr4IQXIxU

Edit: oh, apparently embedding is automatic now.  Sweet!

 

[nighthob]

This would be rational. But, and I think it's been lost in all this, I believe Walt Anderson reads the rule book and did HIS job before the AFCCG. I believe he measured the PSI in the footballs (as required). I'll bet, even, that every ref did this before games. Whether it matters, the rules call for it, so they did it. I think that's noteworthy.

That's not what I'm talking about, I mean the rational response would be "We can't control temperature and therefore after the game starts people regularly play with footballs out of the legal range. Oh well, it is what it is," and just proceed as they have for 80+ years. But instead they've launched this Rube Goldberg scheme of testing all 24 balls at the halftime of every game to pretend that it's somehow important when it clearly isn't.

 

[cornwalls@6]

The NFLPA didn't "give away" player rights regarding discipline in the last negotiations.  They started from this position, included a revamped discipline system as a bargaining point, and gave it up, presumably in return for something else.  Goodell had this power in 2009,.

Stand corrected on wording. Fair to say he failed badly to protect his members from this kind of draconian punishment? At any rate, not sure what benefit there is to him going scorched earth on the league. Let us do that. His goal, I would hope, is to correct this obviously unfair system of discipline.

 

[joe dokes]

could have sworn that when Clemens was on the Yankees there were a bunch of ROOOOGERRRRRR ROOOOGERRRRRR chants riffing off the Darryl Strawberry ones, but in trying to find a clip of it all I've seen are people talking about chanting Darryl again in 1999 when he was also on the Yankees.
 

 
The "where is Roger" chant happened during the 1999 playoff game where Pedro beat him 13-1 and Roger was in the shower in the 2nd inning. A glorious game I happened to be at.
 
EDIT: nm.....

 

[ifmanis5]

Even the NY times comments are all of the Cheatriots variety. You'd think those folks would be up to speed on this, but nope.
 
LINK: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/04/sports/football/tom-brady-suspension-deflategate.html?&target=comments&hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&modref=HPCommentsRefer&module=first-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0#commentsContainer

 

[epraz]

Stand corrected on wording. Fair to say he failed badly to protect his members from this kind of draconian punishment? At any rate, not sure what benefit there is to him going scorched earth on the league. Let us do that. His goal, I would hope, is to correct this obviously unfair system of discipline.

 
It's true that the CBA doesn't on its face protect the players from the whims of the league.  The NFLPA is weak.  

 

[Dewy4PrezII]

 
1999 ALCS Game 3.  "Where is Roger?" "In the shower!"
 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1999_American_League_Championship_Series
 
I can't embed, and I'm at work so I can't direct to what time it starts, but the 3rd/4th innings would be a good place to start.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZbGr4IQXIxU
Edit: oh, apparently embedding is automatic now.  Sweet!

so in this vein it should go "Where is Roger?" But what's the follow up.

 

[brandonchristensen]

so in this vein it should go "Where is Roger?" But what's the follow up.

"lost his power"

 

[Average Reds]

Here is my concern.
Tom plays this season.
The league appeals and eventually wins.
Maybe even after we win another Superbowl.
 
The league makes the Patriots forfeit the games Tom has played in.
 
If there is a chance this could happen I wouldn't set foot on the field unless the league agrees to not make them forfeit any games.

Not how it works.

Can we stop with this nonsense?

 

[Stitch01]

Re Cossack: arent arbitration judgments taken to court on a somewhat routine basis today and just upheld an extremely large percentage of the time? If so, what is his point?

Re: Forfeit: Its also not only not how it works, but like, what's the idea here? Brady just doesnt play for the whole season (and maybe beyond) because if the league wins an uphill appeals battle the commissioner will retroactively forfeit games from a past season rather than, you know, just imposing a four game suspension?

 

[nighthob]

A big win for the NFLPA to be sure. But maybe the guy who gave away player rights regarding discipline in the last negotiations, should just shut the fuck up and take a measured approach to his end zone dance. What's the benefit of antagonizing now, if the goal is eventually to collectively arrive a more fair and reasonable process.(Apologies for not be able to imbed quotes from the article. Having Mobil device issues).


http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/09/03/de-smith-we-never-trust-the-nfl-kraft-shouldnt-have-either/

 
The clause in question originated like a quarter century ago. And they didn't give away their rights because nowhere in the CBA has it ever read "The commissioner has unlimited power to ignore the CBA and American labor law." It literally gives the commissioner permission to act as arbitrator, does not require it, and does not exempt him from his responsibilities as an arbitrator should he choose to serve in that role. That was the entire point of this exercise in futility, to allow the Ginger Knish unlimited power.

 

[edmunddantes]

got to find synonym for "hiding" that rhymes with Roger.

 

[mt8thsw9th]

 
The "where is Roger" chant happened during the 1999 playoff game where Pedro beat him 13-1 and Roger was in the shower in the 2nd inning. A glorious game I happened to be at.
 
EDIT: nm.....

 
He's not referring to that, he's referring to the Roger chants from 2003.
 
http://www.nytimes.com/2003/10/12/sports/baseball-baseball-analysis-clemens-keeps-cool-on-mound-as-the-red-sox-boil-over.html

 

[E5 Yaz]

Bob Kravitz.
 
http://www.wthr.com/story/29953392/kravitz-brady-wins-goodell-loses-but-patriots-still-take-a-hit
 
Hope you've had your lunch

 

[singaporesoxfan]

got to find synonym for "hiding" that rhymes with Roger.

 
Dodger

 

[Stitch01]

"Well, the million dollars is; thats pocket change for an NFL franchise. But the two draft choices? Those are a very big deal"

Maybe we can sign TRich off the street and get one from the Colts.

 

[H78]

League versus Brady
Pats win again in New York
LOL Gang Green!

 

[Devizier]

Even the NY times comments are all of the Cheatriots variety. You'd think those folks would be up to speed on this, but nope.
 
LINK: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/04/sports/football/tom-brady-suspension-deflategate.html?&target=comments&hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&modref=HPCommentsRefer&module=first-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0#commentsContainer

 
They are, fundamentally, NY sports fans. Proceed from there.

 

[aksoxfan]

They are terribly embarrassed. Cossack especially . He lacks the legal chops for this.

ESPN = Fox on election night in 2012.

That is not a political statement. It's what happens when your skewed view of things comes up against harsh reality in the early morning sky.

Karl Rove still thinks Romney is going to win Ohio.  By the way, I've been greatly informed by your posts during this saga.  Thank you.

 

[Norm loves Vera]

IANAL but it seems to me that all NFL players/families and perspective players/families should rejoice here regardless of their personal feelings for TB or the Patriots.  The NFL was publicly exposed for rigging the case against a player and lost today in an unbiased federal court.  That has to sting.
 
Today was a win for anyone who wears or will wear a helmet going forward for an NFL team.  Whether it's a baby or a giant step remains to be seen, but Berman took a look inside the shield and hammered away making it hard for RG to dispense Judge Roy Bean justice unfettered in the future.

 

[twothousandone]

The NFLPA is weak.

And while current leadership isn't blameless, there's much more blame on the membership. For kind of understandable reasons, they aren't wiling to strike. If they were, I'll bet the CBA could be quite different from what it is.

 

[Three10toLeft]

Anyone catch Cossack and DeMaurice Smith going at it on ESPN?

That was embarrassing.

 

[Shelterdog]

Here is my concern.
Tom plays this season.
The league appeals and eventually wins.
Maybe even after we win another Superbowl.
 
The league makes the Patriots forfeit the games Tom has played in.
 
If there is a chance this could happen I wouldn't set foot on the field unless the league agrees to not make them forfeit any games.

 
Here is my concern.
 
Whatever you have is contagious.

 

[nighthob]

Bob Kravitz.
 
http://www.wthr.com/story/29953392/kravitz-brady-wins-goodell-loses-but-patriots-still-take-a-hit
 
Hope you've had your lunch

 
When I have a chance I'm rewriting this in honor of Bob Kravitz.
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZaMX0Cs5Bc4

 

[TheoShmeo]

Bob Kravitz, a man desperately trying to preserve his Patriots Muckraker role.
 
In reality, nothing about today was ever going to change the draft pick and fine result.  Berman did not have that before him.  As a result, it's easy pickings to say that the Pats are losers in that they lost the picks.  I mean, it's true, but that game long concluded and there was no viable appellate route for the Pats.  So saying they lost it obscures that the had not chance to win it and pushing it forward to today is totally disingenuous.
 
In short, Kravitz sucks ass. 

 

[One Red Seat]

There was a sound clip on of Polian saying Berman's reasons for vacating were flimsy & and opining that NFL should appeal and will win. He acts like Roger is one of his kids. Too blind to see that he is supporting a clown

 

[CoolPapaLaSchelle]

Given the Commish's ongoing commitment to media availability, I look forward to his next presser. Best hope is Rachel Nichols gets her shots in.  Should resemble:
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wc2o8ywKqos

 

[JayMags71]

Here is my concern.
Tom plays this season.
The league appeals and eventually wins.
Maybe even after we win another Superbowl.
 
The league makes the Patriots forfeit the games Tom has played in.
 
If there is a chance this could happen I wouldn't set foot on the field unless the league agrees to not make them forfeit any games.

 

[Investor 11]

Anyone catch Cossack and DeMaurice Smith going at it on ESPN?

That was embarrassing.

The video of it was just on the front page of the ESPN mobile site.

 

[staz]

Even the NY times comments are all of the Cheatriots variety. You'd think those folks would be up to speed on this, but nope.
 
LINK: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/04/sports/football/tom-brady-suspension-deflategate.html?&target=comments&hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&modref=HPCommentsRefer&module=first-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0#commentsContainer

I mean, this whole ride has been just so mindblowing to those of us who remember the Sullivan/Kiam/Orthwein days.

We are the undisputed badass motherfucking reigning champions of the NFL. Tommy Hodson is definitely not walking through that door.

 

[Myt1]

Ladies and germs, Lester Munson:
 
 
 
http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/13572474/nfl-appeal-tom-brady-decision-lead-precedent-setting-court-ruling-lester-munson-writes

This asshole wants to give Goodell credit for setting the bar an inch and a half off the floor and then clearing it with great huzzah.

 

[Mugsy's Jock]

https://twitter.com/davidortiz/status/639478827673067520
 
Ortiz: We got our QB back

I thought Papi was a Packers fan, dating back to his days in the minors in Appleton.

 

[PedroKsBambino]

This asshole wants to give Goodell credit for setting the bar an inch and a half off the floor and the clearing it with great huzzah.

 
...or even tripping over it.

 

[dcmissle]

There was a sound clip on of Polian saying Berman's reasons for vacating were flimsy & and opining that NFL should appeal and will win. He acts like Roger is one of his kids. Too blind to see that he is supporting a clown

Polian parsing a 40-page opinion. Another jailhouse lawyer. Our country has 320 million of them.

 

[joe dokes]

My favorite comment to the Munson piece:
 

Jim Sawicki

Lester, you'd make a terrible lawyer. Oh wait, you were a terrible lawyer. Makes sense.

 

 

 

[Reverend]

Brady walks out to midfield as the sole captain tonight, right?

 
Eh. What do they call those lounger things where two servants carry the master out as he sits in relaxed repose?

We need at least three captains for that.
 
 

Kudos to the SOSH lawyers who got this right--that despite all the deference to arbitrators, Roger had crossed over into tyranny.

Considering that Doty cited the same language of "own brand of industrial justice" from another case, I would think this really empowers the NFLPA going forward. Kessler has Roger's number, played things beautifully, and I would think at least some owners might recognize Roger is over his head, as someone mentioned.

 
This has been, frankly, fun. The amount of misinformation or half-information out there was enormous.

Here's the thing: Most commentators translated "massive deference" to the arbitrator to "it's very hard to overturn an arbitrator's decision."

This is not technically correct.

I mean, it's hard to convict someone of murder. And it should be, yeah? But it's not as hard when the person did it and you have evidence. Here, yes, it's hard to overturn an arbitration because the arbitrator has so much latitude that it's hard for them to fuck up. But it's still possible, and when they do fuck up, then you can overturn it.