Eastern Conference Quarterfinals: Celtics vs. Cavs

[Blacken]

Stupid assholish comments by Love. That's all that is worth saying about it.

Thank you for the piping-hot sports take. Love's comments were salty because a guy one step up from a scrub made a super reckless (no, not dirty) play that could jeopardize the first playoff run of his career and a legit shot at a ring--and are completely understandable in that light.
 

Love was never coming to Boston.  I don't know why people think there was a chance.  If he leaves Cleveland, he is likely going to someplace like LA or a team that is close to contending.

Woj disagrees with you. Seemed to think there was a very good chance before today, both because of the pluses of Boston and because he hadn't seen any reason to give a shit about the Cavs.

More reason to exile Olynyk to Orlando or some shit.

 

[tbrown_01923]

 
Love was never coming to Boston.  I don't know why people think there was a chance.  If he leaves Cleveland, he is likely going to someplace like LA or a team that is close to contending.

 
How about putting to bed us having to listen to that nonsense then?

 

[fairlee76]

So, um, did Olynyk intentionally injure Kevin Love? The Cavaliers were chippy as fuck today.

Not sure if it rises to the level of intentionally trying to injure, but Olynyk absolutely grabbed Love's arm and pulled.  About as much a basketball play as Wade's takedown of Rondo was.

 

[Devizier]

Not sure if it rises to the level of intentionally trying to injure, but Olynyk absolutely grabbed Love's arm and pulled.  About as much a basketball play as Wade's takedown of Rondo was.

 
That's about how I read it, too.
 
Watching live, it didn't look as bad as it does now.

 

[HomeRunBaker]

Not sure if it rises to the level of intentionally trying to injure, but Olynyk absolutely grabbed Love's arm and pulled.  About as much a basketball play as Wade's takedown of Rondo was.

Breaking News: There is grappling and physical contact in the game of basketball!

Anyone who claims Olynyk made that move specifically to attempt to injure Love can point to roughly 137 plays per game where a player "attempted to injure" another player. Shit happens especially when trying to get to a loose ball.

 

[fairlee76]

Breaking News: There is grappling and physical contact in the game of basketball!

Oh.  My.  God.  I had no idea.  Thanks for cluing me in!  Can't wait to watch tonight's games through this lens.  Could be a real life changer for me.

 

[HomeRunBaker]

Oh.  My.  God.  I had no idea.  Thanks for cluing me in!  Can't wait to watch tonight's games through this lens.  Could be a real life changer for me.

This wasn't intended for you as you state it wasn't to the level of intentionally injuring.

 

[johnmd20]

It wasn't designed to injure, I'm guessing, but it was a grab and a pull well away from the play. So it was pretty bush league. But I can't imagine Kelly is thinking, "Imma gonna rip his arm out of his socket in front of everyone."

 

[fairlee76]

Yeah, I'm feeling snarky this AM.  And think that what Olynyk did was more awkward/accidental than anything else.

 

[RetractableRoof]

It wasn't designed to injure, I'm guessing, but it was a grab and a pull well away from the play. So it was pretty bush league. But I can't imagine Kelly is thinking, "Imma gonna rip his arm out of his socket in front of everyone."

If nothing comes of the play injury-wise, no one blinks at Olynyk doing that.  There is a ton of grecko roman crap happening in the paint across the league - and should be stopped.  But as long as they are allowing it, I'm not going to waste too many moments worrying that the arm/hand fighting is something KO is just not that good at - and unfortunately Love got hurt with KO trying to keep up with the big boys.  I'd agree with what Fairlee76 said above: an "awkward" play.

 

[Ed Hillel]

I think there was a bit of a pull by Love first and Olynyk was a bit frustrated and pulled back a bit. I highly doubt there was intent to injure coming from Kelly Olynyk of all people, but it certainly doesn't look good on replay. Relatedly, Love is seeking a second opinion, which is usually a sign that the first opinion is not one that he wanted to hear.

 

[Nick Kaufman]

FWIW, Barkley and all the TNT guys tore on the Cavs last night saying that what the Cavs did to Crowder was far more dangerous and that although Love's injury was a misfortune, these things happen and it wasn't intentional.

 

[HomeRunBaker]

I think there was a bit of a pull by Love first and Olynyk was a bit frustrated and pulled back a bit. I highly doubt there was intent to injure coming from Kelly Olynyk of all people, but it certainly doesn't look good on replay. Relatedly, Love is seeking a second opinion, which is usually a sign that the first opinion is not one that he wanted to hear.

Yeah that doesn't sound good. It's like when a pitcher goes to see Dr. Andrews for a second opinion......Love was likely told surgery is necessary and he's done for the year.

 

[The Social Chair]

Yeah that doesn't sound good. It's like when a pitcher goes to see Dr. Andrews for a second opinion......Love was likely told surgery is necessary and he's done for the year.

 
Or the Cavs doctor told him he'll be OK in 2 weeks, and Love is seeking a second opinion because returning too early could impact his earnings as a FA this summer if the injury worsens.  

 

[Cellar-Door]

Honestly if I was a professional athlete I'd always get a second opinion. The team doctors aren't likely to intentionally Walton you nowadays, but what is best for the team probably has to subtly shade how aggressive or conservative they are in deciding what to do in borderline cases whether they realize it or not.

 

[Greg29fan]

https://twitter.com/ESPNSteinLine/status/592825690585767937

 

[luckiestman]

https://twitter.com/ESPNSteinLine/status/592825690585767937

That whole Adam Silver being refreshing was good while it lasted.

 

[radsoxfan]

Honestly if I was a professional athlete I'd always get a second opinion. The team doctors aren't likely to intentionally Walton you nowadays, but what is best for the team probably has to subtly shade how aggressive or conservative they are in deciding what to do in borderline cases whether they realize it or not.

 
Agreed.  I wouldn't read too much into it.  These guys should be getting second opinions on just about everything IMO. 

 

[Cellar-Door]

That whole Adam Silver being refreshing was good while it lasted.

Why? Olynyk might not have intended to hurt Love, but it was pretty egregious and dangerous move and not part of any legitimate basketball purpose.

 

[luckiestman]

Why? Olynyk might not have intended to hurt Love, but it was pretty egregious and dangerous move and not part of any legitimate basketball purpose.

 
 
Let me see, if Jimmy Butler walks up to Lebron James and cold cocks him, do you think he only gets two games? Shit, if that is true, it might be worth it to have a few guys land some punches on Lebron. If you step on the court when other dudes are in an altercation you miss a game. If you punch someone in their face (cheap shot no less) 2 games. Sounds like bullshit to me. 

 

[Cellar-Door]

 
 
Let me see, if Jimmy Butler walks up to Lebron James and cold cocks him, do you think he only gets two games? Shit, if that is true, it might be worth it to have a few guys land some punches on Lebron. If you step on the court when other dudes are in an altercation you miss a game. If you punch someone in their face (cheap shot no less) 2 games. Sounds like bullshit to me. 

There is a pretty significant difference between cold cocking a guy and flailing your arm behind you into a guy. It's cheap and deserves a suspension, but it isn't the same as an clear intentional punch in the face.

 

[RetractableRoof]

 
 
Let me see, if Jimmy Butler walks up to Lebron James and cold cocks him, do you think he only gets two games? Shit, if that is true, it might be worth it to have a few guys land some punches on Lebron. If you step on the court when other dudes are in an altercation you miss a game. If you punch someone in their face (cheap shot no less) 2 games. Sounds like bullshit to me. 

Agreed. This was such a mistake. If I'm Jae the next time he is on rhe court with JR Smith I would simply drill him in the face with an uppercut and walk off the floor, pausing in front of the camera to say "it's only two games!".

 

[luckiestman]

There is a pretty significant difference between cold cocking a guy and flailing your arm behind you into a guy. It's cheap and deserves a suspension, but it isn't the same as an clear intentional punch in the face.

 
 
You and I have very different definitions of the word "flail." Smith knew exactly what he was doing. 

 

[RetractableRoof]

There is a pretty significant difference between cold cocking a guy and flailing your arm behind you into a guy. It's cheap and deserves a suspension, but it isn't the same as an clear intentional punch in the face.

There was no 'flailing'. That was a strike. There was velocity with the motion that is not found with flailing. Any boxing referee would have called that a knockout - the Celtics didn't call it that but he was out before he hit the floor. If he wasn't out he would never have fallen the way he did.

Anyone who calls that flailing is either biased or has never been involved in striking arts.

 

[Devizier]

Part of the ∆ in the respective punishments is that J.R. Smith's two playoff games are a whole lot important than the Celtics' season opener.

 

[HomeRunBaker]

Part of the ∆ in the respective punishments is that J.R. Smith's two playoff games are a whole lot important than the Celtics' season opener.

It's all political. If Smith did that while playing for the Knicks he'd get a minimum of 5 games. Had Love knock been knocked out of these playoffs with an injury the only penalty thrown Kelly's was was the loose ball foul he was called for.

 

[RetractableRoof]

Part of the ∆ in the respective punishments is that J.R. Smith's two playoff games are a whole lot important than the Celtics' season opener.

While I know the Celtics weren't going to win, what about the fact that Smith knocked out and off the court the opponent who had shown the most effectiveness at guarding Lebron? Think there might be some strategy there? Between Perkins and Smith it certainly seemed like they targeted Jae.

Maybe if Jae is in the game they come back and beat them in that game. The punch looks a lot more ominous in that light - not to mention Smith has a history of violence on court. 2 games is the wrong message for the league to send. Should have been 7.

 

[Fishy1]

While I know the Celtics weren't going to win, what about the fact that Smith knocked out and off the court the opponent who had shown the most effectiveness at guarding Lebron? Think there might be some strategy there? Between Perkins and Smith it certainly seemed like they targeted Jae.

Maybe if Jae is in the game they come back and beat them in that game. The punch looks a lot more ominous in that light - not to mention Smith has a history of violence on court. 2 games is the wrong message for the league to send. Should have been 7.

It just makes no sense whatsoever to intentionally remove Jae from the game at that juncture. Keep in mind that Love was already out of that game: by doing what he did, JR potentially deprived his team of two of their starters for the next round.
 
The guy has a history: not of taking out the other team's best player, but of acting violently when someone else does something he doesn't like. Someone on reddit put together a post with the humorous title JR's Greatest Hits: http://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/34257x/jr_smiths_greatest_hits/
 
Goon wouldn't be the right word; he's just a loose cannon. He's got little self-control and even less of a sense of obligation to his teammates. If somebody's getting on his nerves, there's a pretty good chance JR is going to show them who's the man. I don't mean to suggest, of course, that those are fully formed thoughts that JR had. I'm not sure JR thinks all that often. It was an impulsive act from an impulsive person. 
 
The Cavaliers kind of gambled on JR. He seems to always self-implode like this, regardless of how high the stakes are. They were certainly counting on him to be effective, especially once Love went down. He responded admirably. They're going to have a lot of trouble with spacing with Shumpert replacing JR and Thompson replacing Love. Double-teaming Lebron just got that much better.

 

[RetractableRoof]

It just makes no sense whatsoever to intentionally remove Jae from the game at that juncture. Keep in mind that Love was already out of that game: by doing what he did, JR potentially deprived his team of two of their starters for the next round.
 
The guy has a history: not of taking out the other team's best player, but of acting violently when someone else does something he doesn't like. Someone on reddit put together a post with the humorous title JR's Greatest Hits: http://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/34257x/jr_smiths_greatest_hits/
 
Goon wouldn't be the right word; he's just a loose cannon. He's got little self-control and even less of a sense of obligation to his teammates. If somebody's getting on his nerves, there's a pretty good chance JR is going to show them who's the man. I don't mean to suggest, of course, that those are fully formed thoughts that JR had. I'm not sure JR thinks all that often. It was an impulsive act from an impulsive person. 
 
The Cavaliers kind of gambled on JR. He seems to always self-implode like this, regardless of how high the stakes are. They were certainly counting on him to be effective, especially once Love went down. He responded admirably. They're going to have a lot of trouble with spacing with Shumpert replacing JR and Thompson replacing Love. Double-teaming Lebron just got that much better.

I'm not totally believing that it was an intentional act (though there may have been intent to get rougher with him). I do believe that line of thinking gets more plausible with the minimal penalty.

 

[RedOctober3829]

 

Howard Beck ‏@HowardBeck  2m2 minutes ago
Source: Kevin Love's labrum tore away from the bone, and will need 4-6 weeks, minimum, to heal. If it doesn't, surgery a possibility.
 

 

 

[Devizier]

if the Cavs make the finals - still a distinct possibility - wonder if Love comes back.

 

[nighthob]

While I know the Celtics weren't going to win, what about the fact that Smith knocked out and off the court the opponent who had shown the most effectiveness at guarding Lebron? Think there might be some strategy there?

Strategy and J.R. Smith don't really belong in the same sentence together. Unless the sentence is "Our strategy here is to get J.R. riled up enough to do something stupid and get himself thrown out of the game."

He's shown zero impulse control for his life, I'm sure that this was nothing more than J.R. flipping out in response to the forearm shiver that he took from Crowder.