La'el Collins to Dallas

[Super Nomario]

Good analysis on the best team fits for Collins (Pats not on the list, sadly): http://zonereads.com/?p=2848
 
Has Tampa, Detroit, Oakland, San Diego, and Carolina as best destinations.

 

[Corsi]

Cowboys have signed La'el Collins, according to a source.
 

https://twitter.com/NFLCharean/status/596365821619798017

 

[dcmissle]

So much for going where the opportunity is brightest with regard to individual success.

 

[Ferm Sheller]

So much for going where the opportunity is brightest with regard to individual success.

 
 
Maybe some of those good ol' boys down in Texas stepped up and agreed to supplement Collin's lost wages.  Boosters of the team, so to speak.

 

[Bosoxen]

So much for going where the opportunity is brightest with regard to individual success.

Say what? He has an opportunity to be a starter from day one in Dallas. All he has to do is be better than the immortal Doug Free and he's the starting right tackle for one of the most improved teams of 2014. Oh and he'll be first in line should Tyron Smith miss any time.

Did I mention Jerry Jones will be signing his checks. You know, the guy who likes to sign his players to massive contracts. I'd say he did just fine.

 

[pappymojo]

As long as it wasn't Miami, I'm happy.

 

[dcmissle]

Say what? He has an opportunity to be a starter from day one in Dallas. All he has to do is be better than the immortal Doug Free and he's the starting right tackle for one of the most improved teams of 2014. Oh and he'll be first in line should Tyron Smith miss any time.

Did I mention Jerry Jones will be signing his checks. You know, the guy who likes to sign his players to massive contracts. I'd say he did just fine.

I'm not questioning the move. The money is what it is, and it likely will suck for a while but he must think he is in heaven. It just that most folks do not associate the Cowboys with significant o-line deficiencies. Certain people were saying it was the best o-line in the NFL before this signing.

 

[Bosoxen]

I'm not questioning the move. The money is what it is, and it likely will suck for a while but he must think he is in heaven. It just that most folks do not associate the Cowboys with significant o-line deficiencies. Certain people were saying it was the best o-line in the NFL before this signing.

Imagine how much better it would be with two top 10 talents at the tackles.

From a personal standpoint for him, he still stands to gain a ton from going to Dallas. That's what you were questioning and what I addressed in my post.

 

[dcmissle]

Schefter:



@AdamSchefter


Here's the deal on La'el Collins deal with Dallas: Cowboys fully guaranteed the 3-year, $1.65 million deal, per source. Fully guaranteed.

 

[dcmissle]

By comparison, let's assume he would have gone at 16, the middle of the first round. No idea of whether he would have gone higher or lower, but that's the mid-point.

That's where Zack Martin went last year. His rookie contract was for 4 years, $8.7MM with a $4.8 MM signing bonus.

 

[ifmanis5]

Public reaction: Dallas is really going for it!
If the Pats had signed Collins: Typical Cheatriots.

 

[Dan Murfman]

Public reaction: Dallas is really going for it!
If the Pats had signed Collins: Typical Cheatriots.

Yeah that was definetly the reaction the public gave when then the Cowboys signed Hardy

 

[HomeRunBaker]

There's a certain figure that a UDFA can sign for.  I believe each team has a budget of around $86,000 and can be used on any amount of players.  If he makes the team, then he gets the vet minimum.  The advantage of signing with a good team is playoff game checks.

The playoff checks are crap though (relatively speaking). Making an extra $20-40k per game unless his team wins the Super Bowl where he grabs $100 can't play any factor in his decision making. He's looking for a place to showcase himself for his second contract where he can really get paid.

 

[Kenny F'ing Powers]

This is why I would have burned a 5th or 6th round pick on him.
 
If he's a person of interest for police, you cut him and have very little PR hit. Instead, you get stuck competing with 31 other NFL teams.

 

[Phragle]

The playoff checks are crap though (relatively speaking). Making an extra $20-40k per game unless his team wins the Super Bowl where he grabs $100 can't play any factor in his decision making. He's looking for a place to showcase himself for his second contract where he can really get paid.

 
Well Dallas is probably the worst place to showcase ones ability to play left tackle.
 

This is why I would have burned a 5th or 6th round pick on him.
 
If he's a person of interest for police, you cut him and have very little PR hit. Instead, you get stuck competing with 31 other NFL teams.

 
Yeah but then he could have refused to negotiate and re-enter the draft next year.

 

[SuperManny]

This is why I would have burned a 5th or 6th round pick on him.
 
If he's a person of interest for police, you cut him and have very little PR hit. Instead, you get stuck competing with 31 other NFL teams.

If he was drafted he could have refused to sign and then re-entered the draft next year.

 

[SuperManny]

A 5th or 6th round pick is absolutely worth that risk.

Long snapper jokes aside there is no way he signs a 5th round contract when he'll make millions more by waiting. Going undrafted left him no choice. His agent said beforehand that if he wasn't drafted on day 2 then he was sitting out.

 

[Bosoxen]

 
Well Dallas is probably the worst place to showcase ones ability to play left tackle.

 
Maybe all the glitz and glamor that Jerruh tries to bring to the Cowboys does have its uses after all.
 
But seriously, playing beside three All-Pro linemen might be a bit of a draw in and of itself. If what's being reported is true that he'll be in direct competition with Ronald Leary for the starting left guard position, playing in between Tyron Smith and Travis Frederick can make him look really good. Positional flexibility, in addition to being considered one of the best tackles in the draft, makes him really attractive on the free agent and/or trade market (that contract makes him an extremely valuable trade chip, should the Cowboys be inclined to do so).

 

[Ferm Sheller]

And let's not just summarily dismiss the PR hit. "In other news, Patriots 6th round draft choice La'el Collins was charged with the murder of his former girlfriend...".

 

[dcmissle]

And let's not just summarily dismiss the PR hit. "In other news, Patriots 6th round draft choice La'el Collins was charged with the murder of his former girlfriend...".

It's not just the Pats. Thirty-one other teams took a pass in the draft.

If somebody wants to take the position that 32 teams were stupid, have at it. Everybody can be wrong. It just does not happen in this League that often.

Nobody wanted to draft somebody who could well have been charged with Murder 1.

 

[Ferm Sheller]

I was only looking at it from a Pats perspective but you can substitute any team for the Pats.

Edit: OK, I see you are making same point

 

[Ed Hillel]

Yeah but then he could have refused to negotiate and re-enter the draft next year.

 
I guess, but if he holds out, where is he dropping to? I'd say second round at best, fourth or fifth at worst. I don't think it even makes much financial sense, given he'll hit free agency 2 years faster this way.

 

[Kenny F'ing Powers]

 
Well Dallas is probably the worst place to showcase ones ability to play left tackle.
 
 
Yeah but then he could have refused to negotiate and re-enter the draft next year.

 
 

If he was drafted he could have refused to sign and then re-entered the draft next year.

 
I know his agent said that was the plan, but I have no belief he was willing to sit out the year and miss out on a year of NFL football.

 

[Kenny F'ing Powers]

It's not just the Pats. Thirty-one other teams took a pass in the draft.

If somebody wants to take the position that 32 teams were stupid, have at it. Everybody can be wrong. It just does not happen in this League that often.

Nobody wanted to draft somebody who could well have been charged with Murder 1.

 
Someone probably should have.

 

[HomeRunBaker]

A 5th or 6th round pick is absolutely worth that risk.

There was 100% risk without any reward....it was assured to have failed as his agent sent out the statement to all teams that they would go this route if selected.

It didn't make financial sense for him to sign as a 5th/6th rounder so the teams knew this wasn't a bluff. 32 GM's understood this.

 

[dcmissle]

I think his people were telling teams Saturday, don't bother.

You combine that threat with the inherent risk, nobody bothered.

don't know where this comes from, but PFT says 26 teams expressed at least some interest after the draft.

 

[pappymojo]

There was 100% risk without any reward....it was assured to have failed as his agent sent out the statement to all teams that they would go this route if selected.

It didn't make financial sense for him to sign as a 5th/6th rounder so the teams knew this wasn't a bluff. 32 GM's understood this.

Agents sometimes bluff.

 

[Bosoxen]

Agents sometimes bluff.

 
You must be one hell of a poker player.
 
Some of you guys are sounding like you're operating completely with the benefit of hindsight. As dcmissle pointed out, he had the looming specter of a potential life sentence at the time of the draft. This wasn't some kicker or punt returner on which it's ok to spend a 6th or 7th round pick. This had the potential of not only being a wasted pick, but also being a PR disaster. Whatever the risk/reward calculus was for teams, it's clear all 32 of them thought the risk far outweighed the potential reward. The calculus completely changed when he was cleared, but that doesn't change the fact that he was a monumental risk until that point.
 
Frankly, it also seems like it's a load of hand-wringing over the fact that he chose the Cowboys over the Pats. The nerve of that guy.

 

[jsinger121]

 
You must be one hell of a poker player.
 
Some of you guys are sounding like you're operating completely with the benefit of hindsight. As dcmissle pointed out, he had the looming specter of a potential life sentence at the time of the draft. This wasn't some kicker or punt returner on which it's ok to spend a 6th or 7th round pick. This had the potential of not only being a wasted pick, but also being a PR disaster. Whatever the risk/reward calculus was for teams, it's clear all 32 of them thought the risk far outweighed the potential reward. The calculus completely changed when he was cleared, but that doesn't change the fact that he was a monumental risk until that point.
 
Frankly, it also seems like it's a load of hand-wringing over the fact that he chose the Cowboys over the Pats. The nerve of that guy.

 
One thing Dallas had going for them as they had a lot of contact with him during the draft along did extensive background check on the entire situation.

 

[RetractableRoof]

 
One thing Dallas had going for them as they had a lot of contact with him during the draft along did extensive background check on the entire situation.

And from the press conference, this appears to be one strong willed guy - and carrying some major anger over this situation.  It would not surprise me if he performed every bit the 1st round pick he was supposed to be and with a serious edge to boot.  He made the statement (paraphrasing) that it is his hope that the current Cowboys line be known as the best line in history.  So he didn't shy away from going to a stocked line - he seemed to embrace it.
 
How he is positioned will be interesting.  As said above, the Cowboys weakest offensive line link is the human penalty flag - Doug Free.  If they replaced Free with Collins, that would be an amazing quality jump (assuming Collins plays out).  But it sounds like he will instead be slotting in elsewhere.  It will be fun to watch this play out.
 
Has a QB ever performed in a rocking chair during a game?  I think the Cowboys have done the best that could be done to keep Romo upright for as much of that contract as possible.

 

[pappymojo]

 
You must be one hell of a poker player.
 
Some of you guys are sounding like you're operating completely with the benefit of hindsight. As dcmissle pointed out, he had the looming specter of a potential life sentence at the time of the draft. This wasn't some kicker or punt returner on which it's ok to spend a 6th or 7th round pick. This had the potential of not only being a wasted pick, but also being a PR disaster. Whatever the risk/reward calculus was for teams, it's clear all 32 of them thought the risk far outweighed the potential reward. The calculus completely changed when he was cleared, but that doesn't change the fact that he was a monumental risk until that point.
 
Frankly, it also seems like it's a load of hand-wringing over the fact that he chose the Cowboys over the Pats. The nerve of that guy.

 
Respectfully disagree.  In terms of assests spent, drafting this guy with a 6th or 7th round pick is very low cost and I'm saying this for any team, not just the Patriots.  There were three potential outcomes.  (1) the guy is found to be connected to a horrible crime after you made the selection.  The result is a lot of hand wringing and public noise, but you hold a press conference announce that in light of the findings you are not offering him a contract and explain that at the time of your selection, his connection to the crime had not been properly established.  (2) the guy is found to not be connected to the horrible crime, but elects not to sign with your team.  You hold a press conference and express your disappointment with his decision but also express relief that while the nature of the crime was horrific, you are happy that this young man's life wasn't permanently impacted by a false association.  (3) the guy is found to not be connected to the horrible crime and elects to sign with your team.  High fives all around.  PR gold mine.  You took a chance on the guy because you believe in the idea that someone is innocent until proven guilty.  Now, if the Patriots did this, it might even help to spin the 'findings' of the Wells report in a more positive light. 

I'm not complaining.  I understand why teams acted as they did, but I don't think it's completely appropriate to dismiss the idea that a team could have taken a chance here during the draft. 

 

[Bosoxen]

I think you guys are forgetting the seriousness of the crime. This wasn't just some run-of-the-mill Ray Lewis parking lot stabbing. This was a Rae Carruth-level atrocity where a mother and her unborn child were murdered (obvious differences aside). I cannot and will not fault any of the 32 teams for being unwilling to risk the PR nightmare that could have ensued.

 

[Bosoxen]

As far as I know, it wasn't widely known that he had an air tight alibi (I can't believe I'm linking TMZ) until after the draft. He may not have been named a suspect yet at the time of the draft, but the proximity of the crime to the draft was likely enough to give teams pause. There was too much unknown one way or the other to take that risk.

 

[pappymojo]

I think you guys are forgetting the seriousness of the crime. This wasn't just some run-of-the-mill Ray Lewis parking lot stabbing. This was a Rae Carruth-level atrocity where a mother and her unborn child were murdered (obvious differences aside). I cannot and will not fault any of the 32 teams for being unwilling to risk the PR nightmare that could have ensued.

 
No one else is finding fault either. 

 

[BigJimEd]

The alibi was certainly reported before the draft. Not sure if the police had time to properly confirm it or not though.

 

[MainerInExile]

The alibi is irrelevant though - he could have hired someone. It took the full clearing.

 

[Tony C]

It is inexplicable that team's fell for the agent's false (imho) swagger/threat. But bottom-line is I'm very glad he didn't sign with an AFC east team and....what a haul for dem Cowboys. Jones may or may not be a great pick in the first (bust potential), but combined with Gregory and now Collins...those are three high ceiling guys.

 

[Rough Carrigan]

The alibi is irrelevant though - he could have hired someone. It took the full clearing.

And it was only a few days ago that it was confirmed that the baby was not his.  But did he know that?
 
Frankly, I'm kind of shocked at how completely the public perception has gone over to "Oh, he's in the clear."  I don't know much at all about the guy but if he was a dangerously unbalanced type and he only mistakenly thought the baby was his, might he not do the same thing as if he correctly believed it was his?  How has much been added to his case for innocence other than his passing a polygraph which is also of dubious value. 
 
Again, maybe this was all unfair to him but it amazes me the value that people are attaching to the paternity test.  What he believed is as important as what was true in that regard.

 

[singaporesoxfan]

Agents sometimes bluff.

True but the agent in this case had the numbers to back him up. If Collins was a 7th round pick, he would be looking at a contract worth about $2.4 million altogether over the four seasons 2015-2018 (we will assume teams would be willing to guarantee that full amount). On top of that he likely would earn the Proven Performance Escalator, worth about $1.5m. By contrast, if he went back in the draft and got drafted even as a high 2nd rounder, he would be looking at at least $5.5m with $3.5m guaranteed for the 2016-2019 seasons. OL prospects are more likely to pan out. than other positions, so I think there would be more than a good shot of making the full $5.5m (and in any case to compare like for like, if he didn't pan out we would also not count the PPE). So accepting terms in the 7th round would have meant accepting a loss of over $1.5m. While that could have been made up by the chance at an earlier start to his next contract, I can see how Collins' agent could make a credible case that his client would simply refuse to sign in the lower rounds.

 

[Kenny F'ing Powers]

A year closer to free agency and the risk of injury or slipping due to a year of sitting on his ass (a real possibility) weigh the other side of the scale.

I think he shows up if he's drafted.

 

[Old Fart Tree]

What a steal for Dallas. Great draft for them.

 

[singaporesoxfan]

Well, the mid-2nd-round numbers I gave above accounted for some slipping, since he was projected as a first-rounder, and I did point out that he would have an earlier start to his next big contract. My numbers were meant to point out that Collins' agent had enough ammunition to make the threat not to sign reasonably credible, and and that's not even counting using the threat that Collins would decide not to sign out of spite at the team costing him over a million dollars, compared to either waiting for next year or becoming a UDFA with a 3-year contract. (Just as Bo Jackson supposedly refused to sign for the Buccaneers for sabotaging his college baseball career.)
 
Seems like the threat that Collins would not sign was credible enough to scare off the whole NFL from taking a flyer on him with a 7th round pick, despite an obvious high level of interest in him as shown by the post-draft courting. He managed to convince all the teams that really wanted him to play for them that they were likelier to actually get him by waiting for the UDFA process and wooing him than by drafting him in a late round. 

 

[Tony C]

It still makes no sense that, say, Buffalo didn't take a 7th round flier on him. I'm in the camp that it was bluff, but at worst you keep a rival team from snagging him. A team like Buffalo with clear need, a lack of a 1st rounder, and a charismatic salesman of a coach -- but no chance of getting a free agent from the south to go up north to a losing team -- had a lot to gain and little to lose. Anyway I like the boys and realize the Patriots after the one team that couldn't take a shot at someone implicated in a murder, so am happy enough with the end result.

 

[PC Drunken Friar]

His agents said this weekend that had he been drafted, no matter the round or team, he would have signed. 
 

 
“We can put it on the record now: We were never going back in the draft,” [agent Rick] Smith says of waiting for the 2016 draft. “If someone had drafted him, we would’ve had a long, long discussion about it, but at the end of the day you can’t go back in the draft. He could get injured, gain weight, or 10 great tackles could come out. Too many risks.”

 

[SuperManny]

His agents said this weekend that had he been drafted, no matter the round or team, he would have signed. 
 

 
In that case did his agent cost him money by lying to teams or does the shorter contract make up for the salary difference in the first 3 years?

 

[PC Drunken Friar]

 
In that case did his agent cost him money by lying to teams or does the shorter contract make up for the salary difference in the first 3 years?

They explained it that he can make more money than most (other than first rounders) if you include his first year free agent salary. 

 

[Kenny F'ing Powers]

His agents said this weekend that had he been drafted, no matter the round or team, he would have signed. 
 

 
All people below can suck it.
 

This is why I would have burned a 5th or 6th round pick on him.
 
If he's a person of interest for police, you cut him and have very little PR hit. Instead, you get stuck competing with 31 other NFL teams.

 
 

 
Yeah but then he could have refused to negotiate and re-enter the draft next year.

 
 

Long snapper jokes aside there is no way he signs a 5th round contract when he'll make millions more by waiting. Going undrafted left him no choice. His agent said beforehand that if he wasn't drafted on day 2 then he was sitting out.

 
 

I think his people were telling teams Saturday, don't bother.

You combine that threat with the inherent risk, nobody bothered.

don't know where this comes from, but PFT says 26 teams expressed at least some interest after the draft.

 
 

There was 100% risk without any reward....it was assured to have failed as his agent sent out the statement to all teams that they would go this route if selected.

It didn't make financial sense for him to sign as a 5th/6th rounder so the teams knew this wasn't a bluff. 32 GM's understood this.

 
 

 
You must be one hell of a poker player.
 
Some of you guys are sounding like you're operating completely with the benefit of hindsight. As dcmissle pointed out, he had the looming specter of a potential life sentence at the time of the draft. This wasn't some kicker or punt returner on which it's ok to spend a 6th or 7th round pick. This had the potential of not only being a wasted pick, but also being a PR disaster. Whatever the risk/reward calculus was for teams, it's clear all 32 of them thought the risk far outweighed the potential reward. The calculus completely changed when he was cleared, but that doesn't change the fact that he was a monumental risk until that point.
 
Frankly, it also seems like it's a load of hand-wringing over the fact that he chose the Cowboys over the Pats. The nerve of that guy.

 
 

A year closer to free agency and the risk of injury or slipping due to a year of sitting on his ass (a real possibility) weigh the other side of the scale.

I think he shows up if he's drafted.

 

[Bosoxen]

Take as many victory laps as you like. I'll be the guy enjoying watching him play with a star on his helmet for at least the next three years.

 

[Kenny F'ing Powers]

Take as many victory laps as you like. I'll be the guy enjoying watching him play with a star on his helmet for at least the next three years.

 

 

[bradmahn]

His agents said this weekend that had he been drafted, no matter the round or team, he would have signed. 
 

How does that jibe with his statement ostensibly about the Rams selecting Collins in the 7th?

There was a team that had drafted four offensive linemen, and they said, "We're taking him." And I texted back, "You're going to embarrass yourself. You're going to waste this pick."

Either way, he's full of shit and your interpretation of what would have happened depends on which shit you choose to sniff.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000492905/article/were-the-st-louis-rams-set-to-draft-lael-collins