Roger G's Wheel of Justice
- Thread starter amarshal2
- Start date
Well, they did pay him $44M last year, so they clearly think the guy is pretty great at his job, yeah.Jnai said:
Gun to my head, I think he survives this (say at least to next season).
Maybe I'm just too naive, but I always thought the NFL was just a little incompetent, but not corrupt. This thing has ow escalated into a all out crisis of confidence with for the NFL and the major networks that are in bed with them. I'm starting to wonder how deep this really goes? I mean, if Roger Goodell has the balls to lie to the nation on the CBS evening news, just how crooked has this guy been over the last 10 years? Is it inconceivable that there's some serious corruption going on that we don't even know about? And I'm thinking first and foremost about the concussion issue - what they have known and when they knew it.
Goodell is as good as gone, but even so, I still wonder whether a Congressional investigation into the NFL needs to take place.
Goodell is as good as gone, but even so, I still wonder whether a Congressional investigation into the NFL needs to take place.
Jnai said:
He's pretty fucking good at the other parts of his job. His job isn't to be popular, it's to make the NFL popular, and between the new CBA, the new TV contracts, and the apparently fairly good concussion settlement, he seems to be rather adroit. People are calling him an incompetent PR specialist, but it may be he's a highly competent guy who's only incompetent at PR.
All that said he made his billionaire bosses look assholes on national TV and that's not career enhancing.
It's not a stretch to believe that Congressmen looking to score some women's votes decide to make the NFL's handling of domestic violence a political issue and decide to conduct an inquiry into how the NFL and other sports leagues handle this. We've already seen some noise from the House in this regard. Sure, it's highly unlikely that the NFL or Goodell have broken any laws, but some of the players in question may have, and so that, along with the various and outdated FCC blackout protections that are given to NFL telecasts, could be enough justification for Congress to hold a hearing. Then, those who are subpoenaed will have to testify under oath, and either admit that they were lying earlier (not a criminal act, but an even bigger PR disaster), or take the risk of lying to Congress.Gash Prex said:
EDIT: I really don't want Congress involved, to be honest, as I doubt anything good would come out of it.
Well, wouldn't common sense dictate that you not trash your reputation to protect an employee who's blundered his way into a PR shitstorm? Whether they keep Goodell or they fire him, Kraft and the NFL will continue to make oodles of money. What is Kraft's incentive to protect Goodell? The league's fate does not hang in the balance.dcmissle said:
There are at least two reasons to keep Goodell. First, the owners are happy with his job performance apart from his handling of the Rice matter. Second, even if the owners now would prefer to see Goodell go, booting him under pressure (express or implicit) from politicians, the league's media partners, and activist groups will encourage those folks to press their other sundry grievances against the league.MarcSullivaFan said:
We may reach the point where Goodell needs to go. Perhaps we are already there. But from the owners' perspective, jettisoning Goodell is not without cost, and therefore doing so over a scandal that is barely 48 hours old is hardly a no-brainer.
Fair enough, but you're missing my point. My point is that keeping Goodell isn't so critical to the league as to compel Kraft to lie for him. DC and I are debating whether Kraft is lying or just naive. I tend to think he's naive, because I think he's essentially a decent man. Maybe I'm wrong. You certainly won't go broke betting the over on NFL people lying these days.maufman said:
Would Goodell have the stones to fine them for wearing non-approved uniforms or whatever the wording is?koufax32 said:
The Napkin said:
If its gets to Congressional hearings, a Rep. can ask Goodell, "Why does the NFL invest more time and resources into penalizing uniform violations than into investigating player misbehavior?"
veritas said:
The quid pro quo is probably (still) no HGH testing, plus 5% more of the gross revenues and some extra roster spots/rise in the minimum wage.
I have no doubt that the happiest person associated with the NFL is De Smith. Dude has three aces AND knows the owner's hand.
dcmissle said:
I'm not me if I don't note that Jerry Richardson - who employs Greg Hardy - was getting a humanitarian award presented by Goodell.
You can't make shit like that up.
Comfortably Lomb said:
Yup. They are really doing that. I'm astounded. It is shockingly stupid and only makes sense NOW if Goodell has already effective been fired. Because there is no doubt that he is being told to do this. He is covering for the owners, which is his job. He's gonna get a great payoff when he resigns on Friday.
amarshal2 said:
We've found our Markinson.
DeJesus Built My Hotrod said:
I agree on the former. On the latter, I fear you're right. Maybe the next guy will get it right.
Yeah, the thing Goodell apparently doesn't understand is that the damage has already been done as far as public perception. Even in some bizarro world where a hail mary connection of unlikely events "proves" him blameless, it's already too late - more people than ever before will always view the NFL as corrupt, duplicitous, and uncaring towards women. A good commissioner never lets it get that far, facts be damned.
I really haven't heard Goodell asked this simple question...
How the hell DIDNT he know there was a tape? Every elevator in America, has a camera in it...and this was in a Casino? I would love for Shefter or someone to ask him if he is just that dumb to not know that. Make him answer.
How the hell DIDNT he know there was a tape? Every elevator in America, has a camera in it...and this was in a Casino? I would love for Shefter or someone to ask him if he is just that dumb to not know that. Make him answer.
You folks are blinded by your bias. Roger Goodell is an excellent commissioner. The game is more popular than ever, more profitable than ever.
Lose his job over this? Get over yourselves. Ain't gonna happen.
Lose his job over this? Get over yourselves. Ain't gonna happen.
There have to be thousands of business men and women who could help the NFL make billions. It's not exactly a business miracle. The product is crack cocaine to the sports public. Goodell didn't invent HD TV, fantasy football or gambling.Shelterdog said:
PR is also a huge part of the guy's job.
Right place, right time. Andy Mousalimas deserves more credit than Goodell for the current popularity.Pete Williams said:
I share the anger over how the NFL has handled this, but isn't it kind of a disgrace that a Congressman calls out the NFL but not the state of NJ for not doing anything!? Isn't it more important that the govt fulfill its duties vs Rice's employer fulfilling its duties?Harry Hooper said:
Mike Freeman has an interview with an unnamed NFL owner that suggests that if Roger was lying, the owners will not support him:
The article however goes on to state from interviews with executives that if the AP report is true, the result will be the firing of an underling and a 7-figure fine of Roger Goodell (not sure who has the power to fine Goodell - the owners I guess). Don't think I've heard that possible outcome before.
The article however goes on to state from interviews with executives that if the AP report is true, the result will be the firing of an underling and a 7-figure fine of Roger Goodell (not sure who has the power to fine Goodell - the owners I guess). Don't think I've heard that possible outcome before.
Multiple posters have mentioned that everyone in the CJ system they have talked to have all said that the handling of the case went along with SOP. Unless you're strictly bemoaning the actual prescribed punishment (which is embarrassingly small IMO) there's nothing to see here.twibnotes said:
So, his claim is that league discipline can only be imposed based on evidence that comes from prosecutors? Some how, I think it's going to be pretty easy to show he has imposed suspensions on less.Harry Hooper said:
In fact, the irony here is that the league and the NFLPA are supposedly hung up on a new drug testing policy because the league wants power to suspend immediately on arrest, without waiting for the courts.
While I basically agree that there's no evidence Goodell is any good at his job (gun to my head, I think he's probably the commissioner version of "just another guy"), I think the salient issue is that the owners think he's good at his job. And yeah, the league is a massive cashcow, but even massive cashcows don't give away $44M for no reason. The NFL is big business, except only sort of. It's not one of the 500 biggest companies in the world (and probably not in the U.S. - I can't find good data). Thanks to congressional mandate, and the weird nature of sports generally, it faces basically no competitive pressure. In spite of that, the owners have made Goodell one of the highest paid CEOs in the world.Drocca said:
The owners clearly think the guy is great. I mostly take that as a referendum on the owners, but I'm a cynic. Either way, it means they're going to be in no rush to fire him.
DennyDoyle'sBoil said:
Yes, I'm waiting for the transcript of the court hearings in Terrelle Pryor v. Ohio that led to the 5-game suspension.
I think it is amazing how the fact there is video colors people's perceptions.
Even the clearly inadequate 2 game suspension is the harshest response to domestic violence by any of the major sports leagues.
MLB has never suspended a single player for domestic assault.
NBA suspensions have been a few games, but never 1/8th of the season.
The NHL doesn't suspend players for domestic violence.
Do I think Goodell is a weasel and probably lying about the league never seeing the tape? Yep
Do I think a 2 game suspension was inadequate? Yep.
At the same time, Goodell has been the most proactive commish in punishing players for unacceptable and criminal behavior in any league, that people are saying he should be fired because he screwed up the original Rice suspension is ridiculous.
Even the clearly inadequate 2 game suspension is the harshest response to domestic violence by any of the major sports leagues.
MLB has never suspended a single player for domestic assault.
NBA suspensions have been a few games, but never 1/8th of the season.
The NHL doesn't suspend players for domestic violence.
Do I think Goodell is a weasel and probably lying about the league never seeing the tape? Yep
Do I think a 2 game suspension was inadequate? Yep.
At the same time, Goodell has been the most proactive commish in punishing players for unacceptable and criminal behavior in any league, that people are saying he should be fired because he screwed up the original Rice suspension is ridiculous.
https://twitter.com/Rachel__Nichols/status/509897773488291840
NFL announces an investigation led by former FBI Director Robert Mueller. Overseen by NFL owners John Mara (Giants) & Art Rooney (Steelers). Final report will be made public
NFL announces an investigation led by former FBI Director Robert Mueller. Overseen by NFL owners John Mara (Giants) & Art Rooney (Steelers). Final report will be made public
The more I think about this, the madder I get. He's so clearly just making it up as he goes along.singaporesoxfan said:
We knew there was likely second tape. We wanted to see it. But we decided the only people in the world who would have a copy that we would deem reliable enough to impose discipline just happened to be people who we knew could not legally give it to us.
Then when TMZ released a crappy version recorded from the original with a cell phone, however, we decided to suspend him forever.
But versions in the possession of the casino -- the place where the video was originally taken and which have a sophisticated security system to protect millions of dollars? Nah. Too unreliable.
DennyDoyle'sBoil said:
Yes, but beyond that: you can get a copy of the video from the casino, show it to Ray, and ask him if he thinks it's been doctored in any way. You don't even have to get into any forensic analysis.
https://twitter.com/Rachel__Nichols/status/509897773488291840singaporesoxfan said:
link to tweet
NFL announces an investigation led by former FBI Director Robert Mueller. Overseen by NFL owners John Mara (Giants) & Art Rooney (Steelers). Final report will be made public
Interesting choice. Hard to criticize his integrity, but his firm has significant ties to the league -- former partners have been the general counsel of the Washington team, the Cowboys, and the Jaguars. The president of the Ravens is also a former partner.
They were there before Mueller joined the firm. But it is an interesting choice.
Edit: typo
Full NFL statement:
Interesting that the statement goes out of its way to make the point that Mara and Rooney are lawyers.
Interesting that the statement goes out of its way to make the point that Mara and Rooney are lawyers.
It is actually important. Almost certainly the reason it's mentioned and the reason they were picked is because the league can claim attorney-client privilege with respect to the investigation. Note that only the final report will be made public.singaporesoxfan said:Full NFL statement:
Interesting that the statement goes out of its way to make the point that Mara and Rooney are lawyers.
It may not even be an interesting hypothetical but I wonder what Goodell's standing would be if he had made a statement on Monday afternoon that he had seen the video and had made a major error in judgment by giving Rice a light suspension after seeing what the video showed. He would have been excoriated for his callousness towards victims of domestic abuse, rightly so, but his continued hold on the job would probably not be in question. With the lies and obfuscation, he's getting a rain of shit for being such an ass about domestic violence and probably costing himself his very lucrative job. It just baffles me how completely the NFL and Goodell have screwed this up and continue to double down.
Harry Hooper said:
I guess that's one way to downplay the importance of their relentless bloodhounds being bamboozled in the quest for the tape :
http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/11503496/ray-rice-spat-face-fiancee-twice-punch-lines-reports
What a lousy bait and switch. How dumb do they think people are? In the context of a criminal investigation.... Basis for league discipline. Just because there's a parallel criminal investigation that means the evidentiary standard for league discipline is higher? Plus, the videotape would be perfectly admissible in a court given authentification and a verified chain of custody.
What a pile of steaming fly speckled shit.
What a pile of steaming fly speckled shit.
DennyDoyle'sBoil said:
Yeah, but they can make that claim without totally calling it out. Same way they pointed that dude served under 2 presidents, so he's good at this.
Cobra Commander thought through his plans and statements more than this
DennyDoyle'sBoil said:
Thanks - that's helpful. What does it mean for Mara and Rooney to 'oversee' the investigation? With the Freeh report on Penn State, Freeh was announced as overseeing the investigation.
Best guess is that every few days, they will sit in a room or on a conference call with Mueller and the other lawyers and get updates. They aren't going to be in there with their sleeves rolled up imaging hard drives. The cynic would say they are there to protect the league and to try to guide the investigation without destroying privilege. My guess would be the mention that they are lawyers is in there is to try to block congress people who are unhappy how long it takes from trying to issue subpoenas.singaporesoxfan said:
I can't imagine Mueller is too happy to have them for the ride. I would view it as a major pain in the ass. But Mueller has been living in DC for over a decade on a G-man's salary and surely is happy to show his new firm he can land profitable cases. Law firms love these internal investigations. They will probably throw a team of lawyers at it, charging New York rates. While Mueller probably won't love the interference, I'm sure he's happy to have the gig.
That may be true - and Mueller certainly is a man of deep integrity - but a lot of reporters on Twitter are already starting to question what "overseeing" means and whether that makes the investigation truly independent.
It seems to me almost everyone calling for him to be fired is doing so because of the apparent cover-up and lying about the video, not because he screwed up the original suspension. This is basically the oldest pattern there is - the coverup is worse than the "crime".Cellar-Door said: