The Outfield '15 version

[geoduck no quahog]

I'd like one of the SOSHMD's to chime in on this (again).
 
Victorino had something called "nerve release surgery" on his thumb (don't know which one) in December 2013. That must have had some impact on his hitting (LH?) that year.
 
His right (?) hamstring was also an issue in 2013 - which extended into 2014.
 
The Amateur Hour Website on Herniated Discs states the following:
 
General symptoms typically include one or a combination of the following (depending on which disc is herniated):
 

• Leg pain (sciatica), which may occur with or without lower back pain. Typically the leg pain is worse than the lower back pain.
• Numbness, weakness and/or tingling in the leg
• Lower back pain and/or pain in the buttock
• L5 nerve impingement...Weakness in extending the big toe and potentially in the ankle (foot drop). Numbness and pain can be felt on top of the foot, and the pain may also radiate into the buttock.
• S1 nerve impingement...Loss of the ankle reflex and/or weakness in ankle push off (patients cannot do toe rises). Numbness and pain can radiate down to the sole or outside of the foot.

Using microsurgical techniques and a small incision, a microdiscectomy can usually be done on an outpatient basis or with one overnight stay in the hospital, and most patients can return to work full duty in one to three weeks.  The success rate of this surgery should be about 95%.
 
So the questions about Victorino are as follows:
 
1. Is the hamstring issue a thing of the past? Was it related to the back issue? Wouldn't conditioning address the hamstring?
2. It seems, though, that the back issue came up much later. Do herniated discs evolve over a period of time or are they relatively instantaneous?
3. It's obvious that no one could play baseball with those symptoms. With the success rate so high, is it presumptuous that Victorino could regain all necessary strength and mobility to play at his usual high level?
 
If the thumb, hamstring and back are remediated, and if Shane has had enough time to do essential pre-spring training conditioning, it's not too much of a stretch to predict a high quality Victorino-like ballplayer who comes back, albeit 2 years older.
 
What gives me optimism is that the injuries were neither hand related, bone related, or ligament related - and maybe getting rid of the pain (thumb and back) and hamstring issues will rejuvenate him. That's not a wild stretch in thinking.
 
On the other hand, the hamstring stuff seems recurrent...and being a year older doesn't bode well for that situation going away.

 

[swingin val]

 We're going to be pretty screwed if one of them gets one of those injuries that keep them out for a week without a DL stint, but that's always the case with those injuries.

I doubt any one week stretch is going to screw the 2015 Red Sox. And there are far worse scenarios than having to play a Ramirez, Betts/Castillo, Nava/Craig/Holt lineup for a week.

 

[Savin Hillbilly]

I doubt any one week stretch is going to screw the 2015 Red Sox. And there are far worse scenarios than having to play a Ramirez, Betts/Castillo, Nava/Craig/Holt lineup for a week.

 
This may not be what you meant, but just to be clear--we're not going to be able to have all five of those guys on the roster at once. If the starting OF is Ramirez/Castillo/Victorino, and assuming Holt is the UIF as well as backup OF, then we have two bench slots left. We can have Betts and Nava, Betts and Craig, or Craig and Nava, but not all three at the same time.

 

[Red(s)HawksFan]

 
This may not be what you meant, but just to be clear--we're not going to be able to have all five of those guys on the roster at once. If the starting OF is Ramirez/Castillo/Victorino, and assuming Holt is the UIF as well as backup OF, then we have two bench slots left. We can have Betts and Nava, Betts and Craig, or Craig and Nava, but not all three at the same time.

 
The origins of the discussion came from Ras's post asking what happens if Victorino is gone, so the presumption is that the starting OF is Ramirez/Castillo/Betts.  Therefore, a bench including all of Holt, Nava, and Craig is conceivable.

 

[swingin val]

I was also just listing Nava/Craig/Holt as options for I am not sure any of us know how the OF is going to shake out.

 

[Savin Hillbilly]

 
The origins of the discussion came from Ras's post asking what happens if Victorino is gone, so the presumption is that the starting OF is Ramirez/Castillo/Betts.  Therefore, a bench including all of Holt, Nava, and Craig is conceivable.

 
Ah, sorry, I lost that piece along the way. I thought the assumption was that Victorino was on the roster but temporarily unable to play. </emilylitella>

 

[Idabomb333]

 
This may not be what you meant, but just to be clear--we're not going to be able to have all five of those guys on the roster at once. If the starting OF is Ramirez/Castillo/Victorino, and assuming Holt is the UIF as well as backup OF, then we have two bench slots left. We can have Betts and Nava, Betts and Craig, or Craig and Nava, but not all three at the same time.

I'm not really suggesting that this is desirable, merely that it's interesting and conceivably worth exploring more deeply:
Having Ramirez as the starting LF and at least one of Betts and Holt on the roster means you could pick any 1 of the guys who can play OF to not be on the roster at any given time, and still have a backup for every IF position who has played a significant # of professional innings at that position.  Hanley could theoretically back up 3B and SS, Betts 2nd, Craig and/or Nava 1st if you wanted to remove Holt.  If they're willing to occasionally play Hanley in the infield (and I don't think it's likely they are willing to deal with his IF defense, especially with the ground-ball-oriented pitching staff) they have all kinds of weird positional flexibility.  It could allow them to effectively have the best 4th OF replace a middle infielder in the lineup, and that concept ought to have significant offensive value relative to a defense-first MI.
 
Of course, it may be the case that just about every team could stick an OF at SS and have him put up defense comparable to Hanley's, so maybe this is all silly enough to just ignore...  Is a team with Hanley at SS and Betts/Castillo/healthy Victorino in the OF more likely to win than a team with 3 of those 4 guys in the OF and Holt at SS?  Or should it be part of the Sox plan to use Hanley in the IF as "deep depth" so that they can handle an injury to any one position player on the 25 (but the catchers) without bringing up anyone from Pawtucket that isn't being seriously discussed for the opening day 25?  Or to phrase it a little differently: whichever of these guys (Betts, Craig, Nava or whomever) isn't on the opening day 25, if stashed in Pawtucket, could somewhat reasonably be the call-up to replace any non-catcher hitter.
 
Anyway, grasping at straws, but I think this is conceptually interesting and I'm wondering whether anyone else does.

 

[Rasputin]

 
My point was that brushing off his chances of being better than Betts was lazy. A little more than a year ago he was better than even the rosiest projections for Betts. Even if you think a 4 WAR projection for Betts is fair, it's not a huge stretch to think Victorino can be at least that good. If he's healthy, I think he's very likely to be in that 4 WAR range. His health is obviously the key, but the idea of him being better than Betts next year isn't so far afield that it should be casually tossed out of the discussion.

 
I'll cop to lazy. I'll also admit Victorino feels older than he actually is. If he's healthy--and that's a pretty big caveat--he has a chance to be better than Betts. I think I would still prefer a situation where Betts and Castillo are the primary starters and Vic backs them up. I think I would like to get them more days off than is normal because neither has played a 162 game schedule and I'd really like them fresh and ready to go for the World Series against the Cardinals.
 
 

I doubt any one week stretch is going to screw the 2015 Red Sox. And there are far worse scenarios than having to play a Ramirez, Betts/Castillo, Nava/Craig/Holt lineup for a week.

 
This is true. That week's going to suck, though.

 

[E5 Yaz]

The Red Sox apparently have signed old-friend Quintin Berry to a minor league contract. As a defensive replacement and pinch-runner (consider how many slow guys the Red Sox have in the starting lineup), he could make a solid 25th if further trades are coming for the surplus
 
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2015/01/minor-moves-pastornicky-lavarnway-burns-kawasaki.html

 

[Fireball Fred]

Hard to take Berry seriously as anything but a pinch runner. Though fast, he's not that good a fielder, and he doesn't hit well either. Overall, JBJ is a better, younger player - rather bring him up to fill in.

 

[4-6-3]

Hard to take Berry seriously as anything but a pinch runner. Though fast, he's not that good a fielder, and he doesn't hit well either. Overall, JBJ is a better, younger player - rather bring him up to fill in.

Unless JBJ is part of an upcoming trade.  The Pawtucket OF is starting to fill up with Berry, Tekotte, JBJ (all LHHs), Brentz and at some point Ramos should be getting a shot a AAA this year.  The Sox have plenty of major/minor league OF's for spring training and they are still signing minor league OFs.

 

[Red(s)HawksFan]

If Quentin Berry is on the Red Sox big league roster (or even the 40-man roster) in any capacity other than maybe in the post-season Dave Roberts role (like he did in 2013), something will have gone horribly horribly wrong.

 

[mauidano]

I see Daniel Nava and the Sox avoided arbitration as is usually the SOP today. $1.85 million.

 

[Plympton91]

I see Daniel Nava and the Sox avoided arbitration as is usually the SOP today. $1.85 million.

That's awesome. Daniel Nava is the epitome of achieving the American Dream by refusing to give up and working hard despite having the odds stacked against you. Hopefully, he's got 2 or 3 more seasons of high on base percentage in him before the skills start to erode.

 

[Minneapolis Millers]

That's awesome. Daniel Nava is the epitome of achieving the American Dream by refusing to give up and working hard despite having the odds stacked against you. Hopefully, he's got 2 or 3 more seasons of high on base percentage in him before the skills start to erode.

No kidding. And while his salary is modest by MLB standards, that's a couple of decades of regular Joe earnings. Good for Nava.

 

[charlieoscar]

No kidding. And while his salary is modest by MLB standards, that's a couple of decades of regular Joe earnings. Good for Nava.

 
Except for the taxes. He's going to be in the 38% tax bracket for federal taxes. Unless he lives in one of the income tax-free states, he'll be paying that, too. His agent is going to take a cut (3-5%). Cities/states he plays in have a stadium tax on players who appear there (even if it is just for one game), etc.
 
http://www.bankrate.com/finance/taxes/taxes-cost-professional-athlete.aspx#slide=1
 
It is better than my Social Security, though.

 

[Plympton91]

 
Except for the taxes. He's going to be in the 38% tax bracket for federal taxes. Unless he lives in one of the income tax-free states, he'll be paying that, too. His agent is going to take a cut (3-5%). Cities/states he plays in have a stadium tax on players who appear there (even if it is just for one game), etc.
 
http://www.bankrate.com/finance/taxes/taxes-cost-professional-athlete.aspx#slide=1
 
It is better than my Social Security, though.

I think he still lives in California, so it's 39.8% federal income tax, plus 2.35% Medicare including the surcharge, plus 13.3% CA state tax. That's a 55.45% marginal tax rate.

 

[Rovin Romine]

I think he still lives in California, so it's 39.8% federal income tax, plus 2.35% Medicare including the surcharge, plus 13.3% CA state tax. That's a 55.45% marginal tax rate.

 
His past couple years he grossed $500K apiece.  So, even if his net income gets knocked down to $700K for 2015, he should be more or less set for life, if in a somewhat modest way.  

 

[mauidano]

I know I'm biased but Shane has trained very hard this off season. He is a relentless and is one of those intense dudes that if you he can't he will. DO NOT underestimate him.

 

[Rasputin]

I know I'm biased but Shane has trained very hard this off season. He is a relentless and is one of those intense dudes that if you he can't he will. DO NOT underestimate him.

I'm pretty sure we'd all be delighted if he had a great season, but the guy played 30 games last year, and that's a pretty generous definition of played.

That said, if he's healthy and effective, I think he'll find plenty of playing time. Things tend to work out that way.

 

[hrbrendan]

I think he still lives in California, so it's 39.8% federal income tax, plus 2.35% Medicare including the surcharge, plus 13.3% CA state tax. That's a 55.45% marginal tax rate.

FWIW I'm pretty sure they end up paying income tax in every state they play baseball in for the portion of their salary earned while playing x number of days in that state during the course of the season. everyone takes a piece of the pie.

 

[mauidano]

FWIW I'm pretty sure they end up paying income tax in every state they play baseball in for the portion of their salary earned while playing x number of days in that state during the course of the season. everyone takes a piece of the pie.

This is correct. Gotta couple buddies who played MLB.  It's complicated.  Weird but even in Hawaii, we are taxed for contracting work done in different counties here.

 

[Drek717]

 
His past couple years he grossed $500K apiece.  So, even if his net income gets knocked down to $700K for 2015, he should be more or less set for life, if in a somewhat modest way.  

He'll also get healthcare for life (MLBPA gives that to anyone who spends one full day on an ML roster) and he is elidgible for MLBPA's pension (starts at $34,000 for anyone who has played 43 games or more, tops out at $100,000 for those with 10 years of service time, so Nava is likely to wind up in the mid-range with a $50,000 or so annual check coming his way).  Not to mention all those extra taxes will help swell his social security payouts.
 
Will he live life like a king?  No, but Nava could probably pull off a modest retirement at 35 and, if he's invested his salary to date wisely, see a high five to low six figure annual allowance for the rest of his days while leaving his kids something nice.

 

[Niastri]

I think he hangs around the league for at least another couple years, probably as a fifth outfielder/pinchhitter type in the National league after he leaves the Sox.  He has the ability to put up a very good OBP when his at bats are managed properly.  He will probably earn between 1 and 2 million for each of those years, assuming he repeats last year and not the magical 2013 performance.  Barring mismanagement or catastrophe, he is already set for life and will be way more than just comfortable as a result of his time in baseball.

 

[Plympton91]

Do players get to draw the pension as soon as they retire, or is the a minimum age at which it kicks in?

 

[mauidano]

http://khon2.com/2015/02/03/victorino-responds-to-back-surgery-trade-rumors-ahead-of-spring-training/
 
Shane says "Bring it on".

 

[jasvlm]

I think the more fascinating plotline for 2015 revolves around who will play CF.  Betts proved worthy in that area during the latter stages of the year despite limited exposure at that position in the minors.  Castillo is assumed to be penciled in at that position because he played there (and Betts was at 2b) when they were both up with the team in September.  However, as has been covered before, Betts was playing 2b when Castillo came up because Pedroia was injured.  It is entirely possible that the team already felt confident Betts was capable in CF, and wanted to evaluate Castillo there in major league parks.  To assume that Castillo will be the CFer in 2015 may be erroneous based on what limited information we've got.  Victorino will get his share of time in the OF if he is healthy, and profiles as the 4th OFer in most scenarios.  However, it isn't impossible to imagine Castillo heading to AAA to start the season to continue his development.  The Sox may well have 3 legitimate CF candidates in Castillo, Bradley and Betts, and it is anyone's guess as to who ends up being the guy to play the majority of time there in 2015.  Bradley is certainly ticketed for AAA based on last year, but a year ago at this time, everyone was certain he was about to embark upon a great career as the Red Sox CF of the future-great defense and emerging offensive game centered around his fantastic plate discipline. It will be fun to watch it play out...

 

[Snodgrass'Muff]

Farrell addressed this recently.
 

Though the manager mentioned Betts as a leadoff candidate, he also noted that the outfield alignment — and what role Betts or Castillo might play in it — remained to be determined. With Shane Victorino (whose rehab from back surgery has gone smoothly to date, according to Farrell) and Allen Craig still in the mix, Farrell suggested that playing time in center and right field had not been set in stone.
 
“The number of games played per week [for Victorino] has yet to be determined based on how he recovers,” said Farrell. “You look at two guys who have the capability to play center field in Rusney and Mookie. So, we have obviously depth. We have established major leaguers. So to sit here today on the eighth of January and say this is what our Opening Day lineup is going to be and the positions that they’re assigned to, that’s probably a little premature, particularly when you start to look at center field and right field.”

 
http://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/2015/01/09/red-sox-manager-john-farrell-discusses-lineup-options/O9KuYFa9xhgMVCH28a5PHJ/story.html

 

[luckysox]

I'm guessing injuries during spring training will end up whittling away at the many options that seem to be in front of the team right now.  Do we really expect Victorino and Craig to bounce back and be perfectly healthy?  
 
And even if they do, I think it is important to recognize the perfect balance of old guys who need rest and really young guys who need to learn a bit that this group makes up.  Ramirez and Victorino (and Craig if he returns to form) need rest, no matter how well they play. And Betts and Castillo are going to hit some bumps in the road and will need time to adjust, too. There's plenty of playing time to go around, and Farrell will hopefully pull the right strings to keep guys fresh, but amped up and wanting to play when they are not in there.  It has the potential to be a very, very effective outfield patrolled by 4 guys pretty regularly, and possibly even a 5th thrown in there on occasion.  If they all come out of spring training healthy and playing well...holy crap, as long as the attitudes are right, it'll be a sick outfield.

 

[Savin Hillbilly]

I'm guessing injuries during spring training will end up whittling away at the many options that seem to be in front of the team right now.  Do we really expect Victorino and Craig to bounce back and be perfectly healthy?  
 
And even if they do, I think it is important to recognize the perfect balance of old guys who need rest and really young guys who need to learn a bit that this group makes up.  Ramirez and Victorino (and Craig if he returns to form) need rest, no matter how well they play. And Betts and Castillo are going to hit some bumps in the road and will need time to adjust, too. There's plenty of playing time to go around, and Farrell will hopefully pull the right strings to keep guys fresh, but amped up and wanting to play when they are not in there.  It has the potential to be a very, very effective outfield patrolled by 4 guys pretty regularly, and possibly even a 5th thrown in there on occasion.  If they all come out of spring training healthy and playing well...holy crap, as long as the attitudes are right, it'll be a sick outfield.

 
This all sounds lovely until you consider that only 25 guys at a time are allowed to suit up once the bell rings. Injuries could indeed take care of the logjam; that's a quite probable scenario. But if they don't, the Sox will have to move somebody, option somebody, or go with 11 pitchers. Math is math.

 

[Idabomb333]

 
This all sounds lovely until you consider that only 25 guys at a time are allowed to suit up once the bell rings. Injuries could indeed take care of the logjam; that's a quite probable scenario. But if they don't, the Sox will have to move somebody, option somebody, or go with 11 pitchers. Math is math.

It may be worth noting that at least Pedroia, Ortiz, and Napoli count in the list of people whose injuries would resolve the 25-man roster logjam.  It's not just the 6 OFs.  If the team's OK with Hanley as the backup shortstop/3B while Bogaerts, Sandoval, or Holt is down, you can add those 3 to the list too.  
 
Does anyone know whether and where there are numbers around the likelihood of having basically everyone healthy at once?  An injury to at least one of the 9-12 relevant hitters who don't catch seems exceedingly likely at any given time.  Of course it only takes one day when they're all available for the roster to cause a problem, but I don't expect the 25 man roster to be the really difficult part of dealing with the situation.  It's the playing time that I think will be interesting.  Will spring training performance (beyond demonstrations of health) be a big part of the decisions?  Some of these guys may be underperforming in addition to whoever is injured, but it's pretty likely we'll see a time when there are at least 4 guys worth starting regularly in the outfield.
 
It may also be worth pointing out as always that these are the good kinds of problems.  The Sox may still run low on offensive depth, but the odds of that seem remote to me, and I like that a lot.  It's pretty cool that there will probably usually be more than 8 non-catchers I'm happy to see in the lineup.

 

[Savin Hillbilly]

Does anyone know whether and where there are numbers around the likelihood of having basically everyone healthy at once?  An injury to at least one of the 9-12 relevant hitters who don't catch seems exceedingly likely at any given time.

 
There are two probability questions you're conflating here, though, and the difference is important:
 
1) that someone won't be healthy enough to start today's game;
2) that someone will be unhealthy enough to justify a DL stint.
 
The probability of (1) is indeed very high at any given moment, but that doesn't help with the roster logjam until it becomes the somewhat less likely (2).

 

[ishmael]

Does anyone know whether and where there are numbers around the likelihood of having basically everyone healthy at once?  An injury to at least one of the 9-12 relevant hitters who don't catch seems exceedingly likely at any given time.  

You'd model this using a binomial distribution:
http://stattrek.com/online-calculator/binomial.aspx
 
You can play around with the numbers, but if you assume that each player has an equal (and independent) 80% chance of being healthy, than with 12 position players, there is a 75% chance that at least one of them is on the DL. If the odds of health are 90% that drops to 35% chance at least one guy is on the DL...

 

[Rovin Romine]

It may be worth noting that at least Pedroia, Ortiz, and Napoli count in the list of people whose injuries would resolve the 25-man roster logjam.  It's not just the 6 OFs. . . .

 
In a way the Sox seem to either be fighting yesterdays battles or, from another perspective, learning their lessons. 
 
2011/2012 showed them the problems of not having enough viable starting pitching depth and the problems of roster inflexibility (the inability to trade players to create space and/or absorb the salaries involved in common mid and late season trade scenarios.
 
2013 showed them the virtue of a deep and balanced team on short term contracts.  They lost 2 closers and had to trade for a credible SP in the second half.  With the exception of 3B they didn't have any true problem spots they couldn't address.  Although the back half of the bullpen was pretty volatile. 
 
2014 featured great pitching depth (to start the season), but the team faltered due to lack of offensive depth, over reliance on young talent, the wheels coming off some veterans, and somewhat uncharacteristic signings (AJP).  It was more of a "roll the dice" type of club.  
 
I think that the 2015 club has been built with a lot of internal overlap/redundancy in terms of the starters/offense.  Which is wise given Pedroia, Napoli and Ortiz (as stated above).  Plus this allows some positional shifting if a young player or is injured.  While the starting rotation has some question marks, the Sox appear able to promote younger pitching or trade for a starter if circumstances demand.  While they are over the luxury tax, they're not hampered by long term untradeable contracts (Crawford/Beckett/Lackey).  Nor are they tied to playing huge contract mediocre players (Crawford) - and while that sort of situation could develop at any point in time, the Sox appear to have the depth to spell nearly any of their bigger ticket players should they need to.

 

[Rasputin]

 
This all sounds lovely until you consider that only 25 guys at a time are allowed to suit up once the bell rings. Injuries could indeed take care of the logjam; that's a quite probable scenario. But if they don't, the Sox will have to move somebody, option somebody, or go with 11 pitchers. Math is math.

 
Taxi squad, taxi squad, taxi squad.
 
I wish we had one.

 

[Snodgrass'Muff]

 
This all sounds lovely until you consider that only 25 guys at a time are allowed to suit up once the bell rings. Injuries could indeed take care of the logjam; that's a quite probable scenario. But if they don't, the Sox will have to move somebody, option somebody, or go with 11 pitchers. Math is math.

 
If everyone comes into spring training healthy and we're looking at effective versions of Victorino and Craig, the best move they could make for 2015 is probably to trade Nava. He's the least effective player on the 25 man roster at that point and they have plenty of depth in right field, so his outfield versatility isn't as valuable. Craig offers similar defensive value while having more experience at first base and he has much more upside with the bat. Of course, the better long term value might be to cash in on a spike in trade value from either Victorino or Craig if they look good in spring training, even if it is a downgrade in 2015.
 
One way or the other they will probably move one of those three (Nava, Victorino, Craig) and will still retain a ton of flexibility and depth. Assuming Nava goes...
 
C - Vazquez, Hanigan
1B - Napoli, Craig, Papi
2B - Pedroia, Betts, Holt
3B - Sandoval, Bogaerts, Ramirez, Holt
SS - Bogaerts, Ramirez, Holt
LF - Ramirez, Craig, Victorino, Holt
CF - Castillo, Betts, Victorino
RF - Betts, Victorino, Castillo, Craig, Holt
DH - Papi, Everyone Else
 
That's sort of insane and is before you consider they will have Bradley in Pawtucket as the shuttle guy in case things go horribly in the outfield and some reasonable minor league depth in Cecchini, Swihart, Marrero, Coyle, Shaw and Brentz, who could all be better than replacement level if forced into significant playing time by injuries.

 

[mauidano]

Hanley, Shane and Craig have all been oft injured lately.  It remains to see who is healthiest come April.  Lord knows as many injuries as this team has fought through someone will go down.  This is how the legend of BrockHolt was born.  Ramirez has never played the outside before; he'd better be able to still hit or that's gonna get ugly.

 

[Rasputin]

Hanley, Shane and Craig have all been oft injured lately.  It remains to see who is healthiest come April.  Lord knows as many injuries as this team has fought through someone will go down.  This is how the legend of BrockHolt was born.  Ramirez has never played the outside before; he'd better be able to still hit or that's gonna get ugly.

 
It's left field. How ugly can it get? And like Snod says, we've got pretty good depth.

 

[Minneapolis Millers]

I agree with Ras.  The Monster can pose its particular challenges, but even a mediocre SS should be able to capably play LF with a little practice.  (Heck, it worked out fine for Yaz.)   LF is pretty far down the defensive spectrum. 
 
Hanley's not a statue, and he's not 38 years old.  I'm expecting him to be solid out there, and hoping he'll be healthier for the move.

 

[swingin val]

Is there evidence that outfielders enjoy greater health than infielders?

 

[Minneapolis Millers]

Is there evidence that outfielders enjoy greater health than infielders?

I don't know for sure. But a SS sees over twice as many chances as a LF. I'll hypothesize that fewer chances = decreased chance of injury. Do you disagree? We've certainly seen teams move players from IF to OF to protect them (see e.g. Yount, Robin).

 

[swingin val]

I'm not sure I disagree or agree. Never really questioned that thought process until yesterday and was just curious if there was any solid proof that moving from the IF to the OF prolongs players careers. My impression is many of the IF to OF moves is because of the decreased athletic ability to play the IF position and not so much about health.

 

[Mighty Joe Young]

2B and SS have generally thought to have been positions with greater injury risk due to having to turn double plays. The only inherent risk in the OF is running into walls .. but avoiding those collisions is a learned skill.

I believe Robin Yount was the most famous example of a player moved to a "safer" position (as previously mentioned). Paul Molitor as well .. Although he went to 1B and DH.

Edit : of course explanations given for positional switches can often be just a sop to stroke a player's ego. You really don't want to tell your star SS that's he's being moved because he can't play the position anymore .. Except in Derek Jeter's case of course.

 

[Plympton91]

Wasn't Yount moved because a shoulder injury weakened his arm to the point he couldn't make the throws to first base adequately?

 

[Mike F]

Wasn't Yount moved because a shoulder injury weakened his arm to the point he couldn't make the throws to first base adequately?

Thank you P91. Exactly.

 

[mauidano]

Of course we have stocked up on ground ball pitchers now, maybe LF is even less a factor.

 

[Minneapolis Millers]

Wasn't Yount moved because a shoulder injury weakened his arm to the point he couldn't make the throws to first base adequately?

Not so much that he couldn't, it's that they feared he'd reinjure his shoulder making more and more off-balance throws.

 

[Sprowl]

 
It's left field. How ugly can it get? And like Snod says, we've got pretty good depth.

 
Left field at Fenway made Crawford and Cespedes look ugly to the point of repulsive. The Monster takes a little getting used to.
 

 

[Minneapolis Millers]

Also, it ain't perfect, but thats why they built Jet Blue.

 

[Fireball Fred]

Cespedes is an awful fielder redeemed by a great arm - which doesn't play well in Fenway's LF. Crawford had the problem (pointed out by Jim Rice) that guys who throw left have a disadvantage playing the Wall. Bad fits, both, and both insisted on LF.