Mr. Chemistry

[Jimbodandy]

I'm all for a Kyrie bashing, and I'm sure that data exists that show that his teammates are standing around and overall suffering to engagr under his ball dominance and lack of desire to pass. But at least in Boston, his days off were largely planned for games against shitbum teams. I'm not sure that his team's record in DNP games is meaningful without a deeper dive. We would have won the majority of those games with or without him.

 

[lovegtm]

I'm all for a Kyrie bashing, and I'm sure that data exists that show that his teammates are standing around and overall suffering to engagr under his ball dominance and lack of desire to pass. But at least in Boston, his days off were largely planned for games against shitbum teams. I'm not sure that his team's record in DNP games is meaningful without a deeper dive. We would have won the majority of those games with or without him.

To be clear: I'm NOT talking about the difference between when he plays and when he doesn't. I'm talking about his overall cultural effect, which seems to have followed him down to NYC.

I mean, just as a start, it can't be great to have your best player talking all the time about how the only time that matters is the playoffs, and then, once he gets there, doing the equivalent of sitting down in a pile of his own feces and smearing it on himself while giving leadership seminars.

 

[Jimbodandy]

Agree with all of that. We saw what adding Kyrie back into the mix of emerging young guys did to this team last year, culturally and offensively/defensively. I've never been a fan of massively ball dominant players, especially when they don't have great vision. But he's also conversation dominant. And that matters.

Hayward took some blame for last year (and Brad by extension for playing GH so much). Rozier and MaMo took some blame (deservedly so) for sacrificing team goals in order to get theirs. But Kyrie sucked the air out of both the ball and the room, and we're watching him do it again somewhere else now.

Anyone who has watched so far and doesn't think that Kemba is an upgrade on Kyrie in toto isn't watching the same sport that I am.

 

[luqin]

https://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/nets/ny-kyrie-irving-caris-levert-road-trip-offense-20191118-afdkibkdovdjxab7rbg3zkquzi-story.html

The Nets look like two different teams with Irving on and off the floor, and that’s what happens when you have a superstar offensive talent. When he’s there, the Nets rely on him to make plays. When he’s not, we get performances like the one against the Bulls, where the offense is rhythmic and everyone touches the ball.

 

[Eddie Jurak]

“That’s what happens when you have a superstar offensive talent”.

Still in the Denial stage, I see.

 

[lovegtm]

“That’s what happens when you have a superstar offensive talent”.

Still in the Denial stage, I see.

I remember those days...he really sucks you in. It’s so obvious that he’s so good, that you quickly move into Bargaining. “It’s fine, he’ll turn it on the playoffs.”

 

[NomarsFool]

I saw someone in my town today with an Irving Nets jersey. It's someone local - I thought that was an interesting choice. I considered asking them about it, but it was a kid, and I didn't want him to feel intimidated or bullied or anything.

 

[DJnVa]

Kyrie out again tonight, Nets were drilled 115-86. They were outscored 41-17 in second quarter.

https://nypost.com/2019/11/18/nets-worst-case-kyrie-irving-shoulder-scenario-is-lingering/
I'm sure it's just coincidence that Irving has injury flare up in week before they come to Boston.

 

[The Social Chair]

“I think I just have to do a way better job of holding us to the standard with which we need to play,” he said. “It’s not about who’s playing, it’s not about who’s in the game – who starts the game, who comes in the game. It’s just we have to play to a better standard for the full four quarters. ” Brad Stevens, 2018

“Below-average teams are inconsistent, and that’s what we are right now. … Until we get the group together and find some more consistency ” Kenny Atkinson, 2019

 

[lovegtm]

Kyrie out again tonight, Nets were drilled 115-86. They were outscored 41-17 in second quarter.

https://nypost.com/2019/11/18/nets-worst-case-kyrie-irving-shoulder-scenario-is-lingering/
I'm sure it's just coincidence that Irving has injury flare up in week before they come to Boston.

It's interesting that, even when they play back-of-the-bench guys, the Celtics no longer seem nearly as prone to these utterly disastrous stretches. Hell, Wannamaker-Tatum-Kanter-Edwards-Semi brought them back against the Kings.

 

[Sprowl]

Several posts have been moved to the Tatum thread.

 

[jimv]

More grist for the Nets mill from the Ringer - Kyrie isn't the main focal point, more the overall bad start. If the Nets continue to scuffle into 2020 Atkinson's seat will become very warm

Is It Time to Start Worrying About the Nets? No one expected Brooklyn to be world-beaters without Kevin Durant, but the arrival of Kyrie Irving hasn’t exactly gone as planned, either

 

[Eddie Jurak]

Not as planned, but about as expected.

But Nets should not be complaining. Kyrie is averaging career highs in points, FGA, 3-point FGA, FT, FT%, rebounds, and assists. Isn';t that why they brought him in? What else were they expecting?

 

[tims4wins]

Take the source FWIW, but SAS is "hearing things" about Kyrie in Brooklyn

View: http://www.espn.com/video/clip?id=28129903

 

[Van Everyman]

Um, aren’t we all hearing things? Wasn’t that the point of Jackie M’s piece?

 

[tims4wins]

Um, aren’t we all hearing things? Wasn’t that the point of Jackie M’s piece?

Well A) that piece was over a week ago and B) wasn't that piece more about the Celtics than the Nets? Or am I thinking of a different article?

 

[Van Everyman]

Maybe I’m misremembering (edit: I kind of am). But it was only a few weeks ago (edit: 10/29) that the article with him wearing the hat on the China trip came out. That was mostly about the Nets – but there were a shit ton of red flags in that piece.

 

[benhogan]

wow, SAS is a big-time Kyrie defender.

I'm ashamed of myself but here is the Hottest of hot-takes: Nets hit the reset button this summer.

Durant back to GSW for DLo and
Kyrie/DJ to the Knicks for salaries/MRob.

 

[tims4wins]

Maybe I’m misremembering (edit: I kind of am). But it was only a few weeks ago (edit: 10/29) that the article with him wearing the hat on the China trip came out. That was mostly about the Nets – but there were a shit ton of red flags in that piece.

True. I just wonder what SAS has heard / who he has heard it from. His opinions are generally worthless but he does seem somewhat plugged in.

 

[lovegtm]

wow, SAS is a big-time Kyrie defender.

I'm ashamed of myself but here is the Hottest of hot-takes: Nets hit the reset button this summer.

Durant back to GSW for DLo and
Kyrie/DJ to the Knicks for salaries/MRob.

I can’t see them not taking a chance on Durant’s health. Just like Danny couldn’t resist taking a chance on Kyrie turning it around last Jan.

 

[Red Averages]

wow, SAS is a big-time Kyrie defender.

I'm ashamed of myself but here is the Hottest of hot-takes: Nets hit the reset button this summer.

Durant back to GSW for DLo and
Kyrie/DJ to the Knicks for salaries/MRob.

the team changed ownership after the Durant/Kyrie combo was brought in. They’ll talk themselves into hoping having Durant and winning will make Kyrie happy, the same way we talked ourselves into AD/Kyrie being our solution.

 

[lovegtm]

the team changed ownership after the Durant/Kyrie combo was brought in. They’ll talk themselves into hoping having Durant and winning will make Kyrie happy, the same way we talked ourselves into AD/Kyrie being our solution.

This. If you’re right, you have a shot at a championship. If you’re wrong, you have both players under contract, so you deal them for value and retool just a year later than you would have.

 

[Sam Ray Not]

Durant back to GSW for DLo and

Somewhat depending on the "and," I approve this trade.

Put Eric Paschall in the old Andre role and call it the "Sleepy Hollow Five." (Paschall being from basically the Marblehead of Westchester County, NY always amuses me).

Then grab Anthony Edwards with the #1 pick to fill the DLo role.

 

[nighthob]

This. If you’re right, you have a shot at a championship. If you’re wrong, you have both players under contract, so you deal them for value and retool just a year later than you would have.

Somewhat depending on the "and," I approve this trade.

Put Eric Paschall in the old Andre role and call it the "Sleepy Hollow Five." (Paschall being from basically the Marblehead of Westchester County, NY always amuses me).

Then grab Anthony Edwards with the #1 pick to fill the DLo role.

I think we all know that what's really going to happen is that Irving gets dealt to the Knicks for their lottery pick and that the Nets deal both lottery picks to Boston for Walker.

 

[benhogan]

I almost want this to happen just to see the Garden erupt, then again this team doesn't need any negativity.

If he's ignored by the fans and given no attention whatsoever that may piss Kyrie off even more.

https://celticswire.usatoday.com/2019/11/21/danny-ainge-not-opposed-to-giving-kyrie-irving-tribute-video-upon-return/

 

[InstaFace]

He didn't really have any signature moments or get a lot of love from the fans, to say nothing of major achievements while in uniform. He was here for just 2 years, and was already an established star. I think a lengthy video would be a little much. Maybe something quick, with a few game-winners.

But seriously, what clips are you going to show? Him sitting in a suit as the Jays and Horford make a mockery of the Sixers? His empty chair in ECF Game 7? Cut up some highlights from the one game we won against Milwaukee last year, where Irving led all scorers with 26 / 7 / 11, and then have the joke really be that the next 4 games we got crushed in humiliating fashion and we're not going to show that?

 

[sox311]

[QUOTE="InstaFace, post: 3646743, member: 73971"
But seriously, what clips are you going to show? Him sitting in a suit as the Jays and Horford make a mockery of the Sixers? His empty chair in ECF Game 7? Cut up some highlights from the one game we won against Milwaukee last year, where Irving led all scorers with 26 / 7 / 11, and then have the joke really be that the next 4 games we got crushed in humiliating fashion and we're not going to show that?
[/QUOTE]

This is gold.

Show the Nike commercial, him sitting next to Al and Gordon at the fan event saying he was going to resign, sitting down with the media at MSG saying he doesn't "owe anyone shit." Just roast him. Have Jeff Ross at mid court announcing the video. We need a Kyrie appreciation thread to highlight what few contributions he had in Boston. You're right, there isn't much to show besides some fancy dribbling.

 

[CoffeeNerdness]

or get a lot of love from the fans

Embarrassingly enough the fans chanted "MVP, MVP" for Irving from November to May.

 

[Rook05]

I love this thread.

Here’s what I’d do: Show a highlight package of the 2018 ECF run. The crowd would go absolutely bonkers and Tatum and Brown will never play anywhere else again. (Well, Tatum, at least.)

 

[tims4wins]

They should just re-play the Kemba tribute from Charlotte instead then be like whoops we hit play on the wrong video sorry not sorry

 

[DJnVa]

If he plays, I think Kyrie scores 45+, but Nets don't break 100.

 

[NomarsFool]

A tribute video for someone who was here for 2 years? That seems odd.

Are we going to have tribute videos for Marcus Morris? Terry Rozier?

 

[InstaFace]

A tribute video for someone who was here for 2 years? That seems odd.

Are we going to have tribute videos for Marcus Morris? Terry Rozier?

Reminds me of Classic Rondo:

View: https://twitter.com/BillDoyle15/status/953477892209565697


That is ice cold, but also totally valid, and he can say it because he's got the ring to show for it.

Irving has less to be proud of in his time in Boston than Isaiah Thomas, to say nothing about the manner in which deeds were done.

 

[tims4wins]

Reminds me of Classic Rondo:

View: https://twitter.com/BillDoyle15/status/953477892209565697


That is ice cold, but also totally valid, and he can say it because he's got the ring to show for it.

Irving has less to be proud of in his time in Boston than Isaiah Thomas, to say nothing about the manner in which deeds were done.

Fuckin Rondo. He's the man.

 

[Red Averages]

I expect several, Kem-ba's bettter and Not A Lea-der or Where Is Ky-Rie chants for Kyrie's return... with or without him playing.

It's the night before Thanksgiving, the Garden will be toasty. I'm going with my brother and we're already debating if we skip work to hit the Casino before, or just leave work to go to a brewery to get ready for this one.

 

[sezwho]

Fuckin Rondo. He's the man.

...or F Rondo, while a stud early debased his uniform with lack of effort late. If fans want to celebrate IT, whatever the team achievement, I’m good.

 

[Big John]

I think the best reception for Kyrie would be silence, with maybe a smattering of polite applause. No tribute video, no boos. He's no longer relevant and shouldn't get any unnecessary attention.

 

[DourDoerr]

Rondo's right as the move smacks of Colts' rafter hangings, but bright shiny baubles work and Ainge will take the path that makes it easiest to attract star FA's. My first instinct is that a video is a no brainer, but I'd imagine the C's fans might really let loose and boo throughout the entire video (entirely justified). Is it better then to go without the video and just get a prolonged booing at KI's intro or risk 3 minutes or so of sustained booing? Especially given IT's precedent, I think they do make a video and hope the highlights themselves are enough to quell most/some of the boos - KI did make some breathtaking plays in green.

Edit: rethink

 

[Light-Tower-Power]

I expect several, Kem-ba's bettter and Not A Lea-der or Where Is Ky-Rie chants for Kyrie's return... with or without him playing.

It's the night before Thanksgiving, the Garden will be toasty. I'm going with my brother and we're already debating if we skip work to hit the Casino before, or just leave work to go to a brewery to get ready for this one.

"Not a leader" with "He's a leader" when Kemba is at the line has to be a lock. I wonder if the Garden will be toasty enough for "fuck you Kyrie".

That said, I'll be shocked if he plays.

 

[DJnVa]

View: https://twitter.com/Tom_NBA/status/1197945658021273600

 

[Jed Zeppelin]

He is going to get destroyed every time he touches the ball, this is not in doubt. It would be smart of Ainge to avoid the video entirely, maybe show some highlights during a commercial break. It will look vindictive to air a tribute knowing that it will be smothered in boos.

 

[NomarsFool]

I have no idea what the bar is. In general I don't remember hearing much about highlight videos, other than the silly stuff about IT and PP's night. I would think, in general, the vast majority of former players don't get highlight videos. I don't think they should have one for Horford, for example, who played for the Celtics longer than Kyrie.

Now, if someone tells me they do them for any player that's ever a starter for the Celtics - it might seem petty to not have one for Kyrie. But, my first reaction is that he didn't really earn it combined with the drama over him leaving makes for a bad combination for a video. It certainly wouldn't be a positive for future free agents to see a video of Kyrie with the fans mercilessly booing him.

 

[bankshot1]

Show the trailer to Uncle Drew.

KI does not deserve a tribute video.

I'd show one for Horford, but screw KI.

 

[Sprowl]

I almost want this to happen just to see the Garden erupt, then again this team doesn't need any negativity.

If he's ignored by the fans and given no attention whatsoever that may piss Kyrie off even more.

https://celticswire.usatoday.com/2019/11/21/danny-ainge-not-opposed-to-giving-kyrie-irving-tribute-video-upon-return/

Danny is "not opposed," but he doesn't sound altogether enthusiastic about the prospect. Ainge has an enormous stake in making the Celtics an attractive destination for future free agents, so he won't be bad-mouthing Kyrie in public.

 

[benhogan]

"Not a leader" with "He's a leader" when Kemba is at the line has to be a lock. I wonder if the Garden will be toasty enough for "fuck you Kyrie".

That said, I'll be shocked if he plays.

my money is on:
1. booing whenever he touches the ball
2. a healthy amount of KYRIE SUCKS chants
3. maybe a few OVER-RATED chants
4. MVP chants when Kemba shoots free throws
5. loud booing if they dare show a Kyrie tribute video

 

[HowBoutDemSox]

my money is on:
1. booing whenever he touches the ball
2. a healthy amount of KYRIE SUCKS chants
3. maybe a few OVER-RATED chants
4. MVP chants when Kemba shoots free throws
5. loud booing if they dare show a Kyrie tribute video

“Earth is round! Earth is round! Earth is round!”

 

[Jimbodandy]

The videos are for people we love and miss and wish were still here. Also if they made a big impact here, not necessarily through a ring. Comparison to the Colts or Rondo's BS is nonsense, especially the latter, who never misses an opportunity to fluff his own resume.

No video for Kyrie. I could live with a short one for Horford, but it's not required either.

IT was fucking awesome, and we shouldn't have to explain why a little tribute video was a good thing to do.

 

[Light-Tower-Power]

My money is on "where is Kyrie" because I doubt he even shows up let alone plays. There is no indication he's close to playing in a game and I doubt he is going to push it to get crucified by the Garden.

 

[Lose Remerswaal]

Exactly, regarding IT. And Jae Crowder got one, too.

 

[lexrageorge]

I don't understand why anyone would agree with Rondo's take regarding a short video tribute for a former player. Rondo's bleatings aside, IT4 had a compelling story (Mr. Irrelevant to 3rd leading scorer in the league), and was a key part of the team's run to the ECF in 2017. And he left his all on the court in the process, eventually leading to several seasons lost due to injury. The big issue was the timing of his tribute being unfortunately scheduled for Paul Pierce appreciation night, but that wasn't his fault.

I'd be fine if Aaron Baynes got one. Or Terry Rozier or even Marcus Morris. Acknowledge the player with a 30 second video clip and then move on. Seriously, what else is there to watch during a freakin' timeout?

It shouldn't be difficult for Ainge to call up Kyrie's agent and ask him if Kyrie would want a short video tribute, while explaining how it's likely to be perceived. If Irving declines, then no biggie. Not sure such a conversation is possible in today's NBA. But if it is, it would at least keep Ainge's relationships with agents and star players a net positive.