Report: A-Rod banned through 2014?
- Thread starter mabrowndog
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A decision that MLB would be happy with was something of a forgone conclusion after A-Rod's walkout, but cutting the suspension to exactly one year makes me shake my head. Not that I don't understand the rationale for that length - the end date coincides with the original suspension. But it's such a convenient number for the Yanks and MLB that the optics are poor, to say the least.
On to the court case!!
On to the court case!!
Not to beat the rotting corpse of a horse, but it's total bullshit that his cap number will now be zero. They benefited from his cheating in the form of enhanced production until he got caught, and now they suffer no consequences at all.
And according to MLB TV (Harold Reynolds) MLB specifically notes that the 162 games suspension precludes Arod from playing in the '14 post-season.
And according to MLB TV (Harold Reynolds) MLB specifically notes that the 162 games suspension precludes Arod from playing in the '14 post-season.
Well, he wasn't going to be able to do that without a trade or being released anyway.
Well, he wasn't going to be able to do that without a trade or being released anyway.
glennhoffmania said:
Joel Sherman claims that Slappy counts $3mm against the cap because it's not an all-year suspension, but he's the only one I've seen say that thus far.
https://twitter.com/Joelsherman1/status/422047220951556096
Peralta played in the post-season after serving his 50 in '13. But apparently MLB didn't want to see Arod in '14.
nattysez said:
I believe that reasoning is incorrect, and that the $3 million is due to his signing bonus, which is spread out over a set number of years, regardless of if he is playing or suspended or whatever.
Good news. Hopefully nothing will come of the injunction and the Yankees can move on with the rest of their off-season moves.
Average Reds said:
Yeah, I'm curious as to if any reasons will be given for reducing the suspension. It's not like he did anything to help his case.
genivive said:
glennhoffmania said:
And, these can't be said enough. While it's great to enjoy all the schadenfreude, it's really disappointing all the money this is saving the Yankees.
Ah well, he'll be back on the books for next year (and the year after, and the year after...)
I'm not sure getting rid of guaranteed contracts is a bad thing. I'm also certain taking a one strike you're out approach would fix a lot of the perceived steroid problems.
glennhoffmania said:
If you don't count the fact that they lose ARod, the player, for the entire season. For all his warts, he's still an above-average hitter. Last two seasons:
619 ab, 25 hr, 75 rbi, 111 ops+, 2.6 bWAR
Not great, but probably better than what they have to replace him.
ivanvamp said:
For $25 million, I'm sure they can figure out someone to replace him who's better than that (if they decided to spend what he would have earned, anyway).
Too bad for them that Kevin Youkilis is in Japan.
I agree with this column:
WSJ's Matthew Futterman - Why Baseball's Victory is a Pyrrhic One
[SIZE=10pt]This saga is only going to erode trust with the union - trust necessary to continue to enact a truly beneficial enforcement program. [/SIZE][SIZE=10pt]Selig could have left baseball with an enviable legacy of management-labor cooperation, but I believe the A-Rod witchhunt will have some long-lasting negative ramifications down the road. It's not too difficult to imagine the owners overreaching in the next round of bargaining and pushing the increasingly distrustful players over the edge and a nasty strike developing as a result.[/SIZE]
WSJ's Matthew Futterman - Why Baseball's Victory is a Pyrrhic One
[SIZE=10pt]This saga is only going to erode trust with the union - trust necessary to continue to enact a truly beneficial enforcement program. [/SIZE][SIZE=10pt]Selig could have left baseball with an enviable legacy of management-labor cooperation, but I believe the A-Rod witchhunt will have some long-lasting negative ramifications down the road. It's not too difficult to imagine the owners overreaching in the next round of bargaining and pushing the increasingly distrustful players over the edge and a nasty strike developing as a result.[/SIZE]
JimD said:
Nah .. no chance . The pot is so huge right now that no one is going to kill this golden goose. (apologies for the mixed metaphor). What I can see is a divided union though - there seems to be a genuine backlash developing on the "clean" side of the ledger.
I don't see it that way at all. I think it reinforces to players that a) even the biggest stars in the game can be held accountable, and b) if you get caught, it is better to come clean. Players who got caught and acted within the spirit of management-labor cooperation cited served their suspensions and were right back on the field.JimD said:
I think most players aren't users and don't like the idea of playing on an uneven playing field. It costs them money and opportunity.
Several reporters have noted that there is an increasing number of players who are bothered by MLB running roughshod over A-Rod and inventing new penalties on the fly. These players do not necessarily support Rodriguez's case but are worried by the precedent that is being set by Selig.
Here's a link of the lawsuit and arbitrator's decision posted by the Wall Street Journal's Brian Costa.
http://online.wsj.com/public/resources/documents/ARODMLB01132014.pdf
Enjoy!
http://online.wsj.com/public/resources/documents/ARODMLB01132014.pdf
Enjoy!
DontTauntOrtizMe said:
Only 2 pages in so far, but this whole thing is a pretty comedic read. Highly recommended.
Joe Poz has a great takedown of last night's 60 minutes piece: http://joeposnanski.com/joeblogs/the-60-minutes-report/
Well worth the read.
Well worth the read.
At this point, I think A-Rod's just trolling for attention. He's threatening to show up to the Yankees spring training and he filed a law suit alleging that the player's union failed to protect him (after he wrote them a letter requesting that they not defend him).
From what I've read, that seems to be the best angle to pursue - if it's just "I disagree with an arbitrator's decision", a court is unlikely to do anything about it. If he can successfully argue that both sides in the arbitration hearing basically tried to get him to lose, though, it may have more traction - and the MLBPA doesn't really come off that well from his complaint. Whether it's enough to actually get a court to bother is certainly not definite, but to me it seems like the only avenue that has any remote chance of success.
So the Tony Clark and the MLBPA is pissed at A-Rod too. This guy has not a friend in the world. He is going nuclear. This will not end well for anyone. There will be collateral damage. And I couldn't be happier to watch this happen to him and the MFY's.
Yes. Yes they are. But the drama will linger for a long time I hope. Barnum & Bailey and Ringling Bros. won't be able to top the circus that this will be for Girardi, Jeets and that crew come Spring Training. I am giddy at the thought!terrisus said:
Has there ever been a player banned for an entire season by the MLB? By any major sport? And if so, did that player come back to a 3-year guaranteed contract worth millions of dollars?
The 2014 ST circus will be one thing; the 2015 ST and season opening will be something else (assuming ARod is wearing pinstripes -- or any MLB uniform, for that matter, in 2015).
The 2014 ST circus will be one thing; the 2015 ST and season opening will be something else (assuming ARod is wearing pinstripes -- or any MLB uniform, for that matter, in 2015).
mauidano said:
Sadly, I don't think it will matter much.
Although they're still not going to be very good this year
Saints Rest said:
Not a player, but, of course, George Steinbrenner was banned for life by MLB.
We see how that worked out though.
Yeah, Manfred was a fucking joke. And 60 Minutes did a shit job of following up with hard questions.
Um, who was the main corroborator of the Biogenesis evidence? And, was Bud Selig willing to come in to raise his right hand and testify?
Um, who was the main corroborator of the Biogenesis evidence? And, was Bud Selig willing to come in to raise his right hand and testify?
The Posnanski piece was ok as a well-deserved critique of 60 Minutes, but it falls on its face when he starts addressing the actual case. Apparently Posnanski did not read the arbitrator's ruling, which is matter-of-fact damning.
As for references to Bosch's credibility, what Manfred was getting to (and the arbitrator's agree) is that no one took the "stand" to counter any of the claims, except for Mota who, unlike Bosch - was apparently not credible (no corroboration or evidence to back up his statements). Alex plead the fifth. He destroyed his Blackberry.
I assume 60 Minutes did a typically terrible job of editing the original interviews - as they couldn't care less about news, or facts, or fairness...just how things read on TV's 5-second attention span.
Footnote 9 on page 21 says it all :
In reference to the Quantum of Proof Requirement -
"There is no need to resolve the dispute {quantum of proof} in this case because the violations of the JDA and BA found herein are established by clear and convincing evidence" (my italics)
I encourage everyone to read the report.
{Edit: "Bob" was named in the arbitration report. MLB paid for evidence. The evidence was substantiated. The second collection of evidence was not utilized, though paid for. Is that illegal or sleazy? I would expect the same if someone was investigating me}
As for references to Bosch's credibility, what Manfred was getting to (and the arbitrator's agree) is that no one took the "stand" to counter any of the claims, except for Mota who, unlike Bosch - was apparently not credible (no corroboration or evidence to back up his statements). Alex plead the fifth. He destroyed his Blackberry.
I assume 60 Minutes did a typically terrible job of editing the original interviews - as they couldn't care less about news, or facts, or fairness...just how things read on TV's 5-second attention span.
Footnote 9 on page 21 says it all :
In reference to the Quantum of Proof Requirement -
"There is no need to resolve the dispute {quantum of proof} in this case because the violations of the JDA and BA found herein are established by clear and convincing evidence" (my italics)
I encourage everyone to read the report.
{Edit: "Bob" was named in the arbitration report. MLB paid for evidence. The evidence was substantiated. The second collection of evidence was not utilized, though paid for. Is that illegal or sleazy? I would expect the same if someone was investigating me}
mauidano said:
It's like a Tarantino movie. His teammates hate him, the owners hate him, the fans hate him and the union hates him. And he's gonna walk away with all the money and some hot tail. Bastard!
Something interesting I noticed reading over the documents revealed today that I hadn't noticed mentioned before (it may well have been, I just don't recall noticing it) is, in the suspension letter from Selig to Rodriguez, it saying:
"In the event you commit a subsequent violation of the Program in the future, you will be suspended permanently from Major League Baseball."
Granted, Rodriguez isn't all that young and probably doesn't have too many years ahead of him regardless, but, thought it was interesting (since, for regular suspensions, it would be 50, 100, then lifetime on the 3rd).
"In the event you commit a subsequent violation of the Program in the future, you will be suspended permanently from Major League Baseball."
Granted, Rodriguez isn't all that young and probably doesn't have too many years ahead of him regardless, but, thought it was interesting (since, for regular suspensions, it would be 50, 100, then lifetime on the 3rd).
mauidano said:
This whole situation has made my winter. What I find most "ARod" about this whole situation is that he had absolutely no problems hiding behind the MLBPA and the JDA/CBA in order to keep playing last year. Now that they've all run their due course, and the process he agreed to as finished, he suddenly has a problem with the MLBA, JDA, and CBA?
That's so ARod.
Jaylach said:
Not my area of expertise, but almost all federal lawsuits trying to overturn arbitration decisions that come about as a result of Union collective bargaining include a claim agiant the Union for failing to do its job. I'm not sure if its a prerequisite to such a suit because the individual's first recourse is suposed to be his Union, or if its something else, but i wouldn't read too much into the inclusion of the MLBPA into teh federal suit. (Of course there may be a real divide between ARod and the Union, but that's a different issue).
Has there ever been a player banned for an entire season by the MLB? By any major sport? And if so, did that player come back to a 3-year guaranteed contract worth millions of dollars?
The 2014 ST circus will be one thing; the 2015 ST and season opening will be something else (assuming ARod is wearing pinstripes -- or any MLB uniform, for that matter, in 2015).
There have been several NFL players to be suspended for a season. Alex Karras and Paul Horning are two examples. But none in recent years that I can think of.
The 2014 ST circus will be one thing; the 2015 ST and season opening will be something else (assuming ARod is wearing pinstripes -- or any MLB uniform, for that matter, in 2015).
There have been several NFL players to be suspended for a season. Alex Karras and Paul Horning are two examples. But none in recent years that I can think of.
DontTauntOrtizMe said:
Nice ruling and good reasoning. I'd also recommend everyone read the actual arbitrator's decision (skip to the end of the document.)
Some points:
- Basically, MLB seemed to rely on Bosch, plus hundreds of blackberry texts, plus phone call records, plus Bosch certifying the copies of the notebooks were in fact his. So while Bosch is a weak witness, the texts, calls and notes give him a ton of credibility.
- ARod's team wanted to smear Bosch but were basically shut down (the arbitrator acknowledged Bosch was a dealer in illegal drugs, but, basically, any person who testifies to providing illegal PEDs to an athlete falls into that category).
- ARod did not testify in the hearing at all. There was no "alternate scenario" put forward to explain the facts.
As to the articles that say this is a hollow victory and everyone's hands are dirty and so forth:
a) no one is proposing a better PED policy
b) when the people involved in the situation are scumbags, scumbags will be testifying. That's kind of how it works.
And to pre-empt a potential line of inquiry here (and a whine that I think ARod's team has already pursued).....the Fifth Amendment privilege against self-incrimination does not apply in private proceedings like collectively bargained arbitration, so the arbitrator's arguably negative connotation of Arod's silence -- while impermissible in a criminal court trial -- is not a Constitutional problem (assuming the arbitration agreement doesn't require the opposite).
Boras chimes in, irrelevantly:
I dont think "putting people behind bars" falls within Selig's power, even under the most generous reading of the "best interests of baseball" clause. How is that a "flaw in the system"?
And "exonerated?! (Nice theatre potential if Bosch is ever charged criminally and Arod is called to testify by the prosecution).