The Blazers got nothing for Powell. Keon Johnson?
Unless you mean salary relief. As far as players go, Grant is more than anything the Blazers got back.
16 Days in January—Determining Trade Deadline Activity
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Unless you mean salary relief. As far as players go, Grant is more than anything the Blazers got back.
They also got Bledsoe and an early 2nd, that to me is way more than just Grant. Also.. yeah a ton of salary relief. Now POR doesn't want Bledsoe, but they might flip him.
But also, comparing what you get back while clearing $90M in cap to what you get back in a non-salary dump isn't going to be much use, since salary relief is a huge asset.
What can they flip Bledsoe for? Another 2nd round pick? Bledsoe is a nothing to a rebuilding team.
edit: Regardless, the rumored C's deals have the C's paying far more than what the market has shown so far. Donte is also a RFA. Maybe his injury and current off year will keep his price down, so that's a plus.
Celtics have trade exceptions as well, but none of rumors mention them. I'd like to get at least something for them.
We're looking to shed salary not add it, if they use the TPEs it will be in the summer or in a deal where each side eats players into TPEs, creating new TPEs.
Maybe?
I don't think the Celtics are paying more than market in any of the rumors really. Grant Williams is a late first who had zero value and now has a bit. Donte was considered much better than him last year before getting hurt. I wouldn't do it, but that's a reasonable price.
You're comparing what the market is for teams willing to take on huge amounts of salary, it isn't even remotely comparable.
I mean, I bet we could get a lot for Grant and/or Schroder if we were willing to eat a ton of salary, but we aren't, so we'll have to pay retail. Donte for Schroder is a great return on a guy who the best offer we've heard is a 2nd and $1M in salary relief. Grant Williams trade value is what.. a couple 2nds maybe?
Edit- for example... if we went to WAS and said... we'll trade you Grant Williams AND eat Davis Bertans into a TPE... we'd have some real value coming in. If we just said... what will you give us for Williams, the answer would be a lot lower.
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I'm not sure there is anyone out there of interest, but the Celtics could use a TPE to take on a contract, pay the tax, but do so with eyes wide open that they are improving the team without giving up anything other than money.
Look at the rumored Beasley deal. I'd rather have JRich. I'd rather have Grant than DD too. All the rumored deals are pretty meh on the Celtics end.
Bledsoe is a negative asset at this point, but I agree with your larger point the value overall was more than "just Grant" would be...
Yes we discussed that one and it is batshit crazy, but if you're pulling one deal, there are always insane deal rumors, that's why teams leak them to try and move markets. If that deal gets done it's an overpay, but none of the other rumors have been, and there were tons of overpay rumors for CJ all year (multiple 1sts, etc.), that's how rumors work.
I may be naive, but I have enough faith in ownership that Stevens could do this. I would bet they talked about Powerll, for example, who fits the above as well as McCollum. The issue is that those guys aren't clean enough fits to be sure and I do think ownership likely has said "it's a $15-20 mil decision to add someone like that, even if we dump some other contracts, so we need to really put ourselves in a great position" I personally am bigger on Powell's fit than many, but I acknowledge that's a pretty big contract to add to their cap sheet for a guy without a super well-rounded skillset.
The best way to upgrade the roster remains an offseason deal, imo, and that is where they are likely focused. So the goal at deadline is save the tax (which isn't just about this year---it's about delaying repeater penalties) and then add the salary in offseason when there are more options and more ways to fit in guys around the big acquisitions. It may fail, but it is rational
If they get Beasley for Richardson (a better fit, essentially) which helps in future---great. If they add a Coby White for a small asset and Schroder, great. But I think the bar for adding salary AND impacting flexibility going fowrard should be fairly high.
The dream around here has been Brad Beal - is he meaningfully better than CJ? He is an inch taller, a year younger, and equally efficient. Neither is a good defender. Beal is much more expensive, both in terms of money and assets it would take to get him, and a higher usage player. I dunno, if the Celtics are really exploring Beal they should have been in on CJ at the much lower price.
(This post is really just a backwards argument against Beal.)
Do you mean as straight dumps, or as part of a deal?
Guys who are available likely who fit:
Dinwiddie
Bertans
Robinson?
Morris (Marcus)
WHite
Young (Thad)
McDermott
Wood
Covington
Warren?
Ross
Bagley
Lamb
So nobody I would go into the tax for. In the summer though, lot of options.
Poster said to pay the tax to improve the team, so I assume they meant the deadline.
On another subject, someone in some thread posted a tweet that said JRich would take over at PG if DS were traded. That DS wasn't needed. Maybe he's not needed as a PG, but they still need an 8th rotation player. Or maybe Ime will go with a 7 man roster or they think RL/someone else is ready for that role. Who is the 9th man on this team anyway? After assuming it was Romeo, I went to look up minutes played and he's... 9th. That doesn't necessarily mean he's 9th in the rotation though. He was getting more consistent play earlier in the year when the team wasn't healthy. I'd assume if the C's dumped DS and did nothing else, RL would be the front runner for 8th man.
Also, doesn't GW+DS for DD get the C's under the tax? I don't care for that deal at all. The team would have to make a decision on DD this offseason, and if he plays like crap the rest of the year... ugh. If he rebounds and plays well, he's in line for a pay day. I guess there's a chance to lock him up on the cheap for 4 years but that comes with a gamble. I don't get it from the C's perspective. Like, what does DD get paid? $10-12 mil a year or closer to 16-18? Is DD a player you want to add to the Jaylord core? Does he replace Smart? It's a move that requires some other moves this offseason, at least if they intend to keep DD. It also leaves the C's short a rotation player. He would be a good fit along Jaylord, I'd just hope they could do better than DD.
No clue what this team does, but I have a feeling I'm not going to like it. I'd be content with doing nothing. I'd prefer them to add talent. The C's are playing their best basketball in the last 2 years. I get if they can't/don't want to add more salary, but now is not the time to dump a rotation player for nothing (not related to DD, he is something) The C's are 11-4 over their last 15, 7-1 over their last 8, on a 5 game winning streak and blowing teams off the court.
Season ranks:
1st in 2PFG% against, holding teams to .493, and 2nd in FG% against at .433.
14th in 2PFG% at .528, 20th in FG% at .450.
22nd in 3P% at .340. This has been trending upwards every month.
8th in 3P% against at .341. In another few games, they could be outshooting their opponents from 3.
3rd in rebounds, 2nd in blocks.
Totally weird stat here: 20th in assists at 23.2. 1st in assists against at 21.6. It's weird because often times we'll mention other teams beautiful ball movement and wonder why the C's can't do that.
18th in TO at 14.2. 10th in causing TO at 14.0.
1st in FT% at .817, 21st in FTA. 9th in FTA against.
19th in PPG at 108.1, 4th in PPG against at 104.0.
7th in point differential at 4.1
25th in Strength of Schedule. Is that right? I know there was chatter in early December that the C's remaining schedule from January on would be the easiest in the NBA.
All these numbers confirm the same thing we see on the court. They scream add a PG who can shoot the 3 (preferably one with size and/or is passable on D) I'm not sure that player is available right now. Going with JRich in the meantime is fine, but dumping DS for nothing isn't.
I don't know if all this is a schedule mirage and really bad timing, but I think they are left in a position where they can't subtract players. The only way the team should be subtracting rotation players is if the player returning is at least as good as John Collins.
Straight dumps. I was replying to this since I didn't originally quote them. The TPE would be far more attractive to a team trying to save money this season than expiring contracts. The C's could use that to their advantage if the owner was willing to pay the tax. Norm Powell is not that guy, though. TJ Warren could be interesting if a team were confident about his health. Buy low candidate and they keep his rights. If he returned to form, I would absolutely love him next to Jaylord. Not worth that gamble though. Out of everyone on that list, he interest me the most. That core 4 would be deadly and cause match up nightmares for everyone.
Agree with everything here. Need 8 players and as much as DS has played poorly recently, he is still far & away the team's 3rd leading scorer.
Yes on moving Schroder/Nesmith (3rd team) for DD, or other blocked players.
No thanks on DS salary dump + 2nd. Keep him and compete
Collins is worth upending the apple cart, with the idea of getting that BALLHANDLER by any means necessary this summer.
Hard no on moving Grant as any kind of throw-in or 2nds.
He's replacing Horford as the team's sWing(4) next season at this rate.
Haliburton to Pacers just made Brogdon more available this summer.
48hrs until trade deadline - still plenty of time. I like Brad's patience
Have they? Since discontinuing playing them together we’ve seen one of them on the floor at all times during non-garbage minutes with the one exception of that train wreck 4Q collapse a couple weeks when the No-PG lineup fooled Ime into thinking it can work against 4Q defenses.
Has Malik Beasley greatly improved as a defender the last few years? He never struck me as a good defender his first few years in the league. I haven't been paying too much attention. I don't question his 3 point shot at all. He's a great fit offensively, though he's a below average passer by the numbers. I was a big fan of his until the off court problems. He's on a really cheap deal too. He'd be hard to cheer for, but from a basketball and financial standpoint, he makes a lot of sense. I just don't like the asking price. There has to be more to it.
It's the one rumor that wont die and I guess there's a lot of chatter about it in Minnesota.
8'4.5 standing reach, 6'7 wingspan. Not particularly long, or short.
It's the one rumor that wont die and I guess there's a lot of chatter about it in Minnesota.
8'4.5 standing reach, 6'7 wingspan. Not particularly long, or short.
Why would the Kings want Horford, especially now? The Kings are going to need Barnes for spacing.
Horford is theoretically a better fit with Sabonis than Holmes and I assume they're going to be trading Holmes soon anyways. And Barnes only has a year left + Horford 2022 salary is cheaper?
If he really is a plus defender and returns to his previous shooting numbers, he's exactly what we've wanted for the last 3 or so years. Minus the off court issues.
Beasley is 2nd in the NBA in 3PA/36 at 11.5. Only Steph Curry is ahead of him.
We want some one who will just let it fly and isn't exposed on D, never mind someone good at it. . Check out this game log. He lets it rain. Last 3 years, he shot .397, 398/1002 from 3. He's also very good from the corner. He's perfectly fine just standing in a corner, shooting 3s. He's shown the ability to score by other means in the past. He's not afraid to shoot. If he's a plus defender, he goes from marginal player to elite 3 and D/fringe all star. That's especially true if he's averaging close to 20 points a game.
Tatum averages 8.4 3PA/G in 36.2 mpg.
Beasley averages 8.3 3PA/G in 26.1 mpg.
He'd probably be starting on the C's and getting close to 10+ 3PA. If he could return to form and hit close to 40% of them, that's 12 points a night on just 3s. Add in another 5 points from 2s and FTs and your at 17. TL/Tatum/Brown/Beasley would be pretty deadly. You have one guy who can clean up the mess with a put back or pass it to the open man for a 3.
18-21 Beasley has some serious gravity. If he weren't starting, he'd give the C's a legit sniper off the bench. Grant and JRich are fine, but they don't have Beasley's presence. Combined, the 2 of them are averaging 7.1 3PA/G, and 10.6 3PA/36. AKA less than Beasley. Beasley has 440 3PA in 1381 minutes. Grant + Richardson have 328 3PA combined in 2220 minutes. I'm trying to think of a Celtics player in recent years who let it fly as much as Beasley. I can come up with Kemba Walker, but he had an entirely different role. Evan Fournier isn't it.
Give that player plus defense and it's on. I'd guess even with plus defense, he's not the most switchable guy. His measurables aren't awful (6'4, 6'7, 8.4'.5) but he's not Romeo (6'4, 7'0, 8'6.5). He would most likely struggle some against some longer 3s and a lot of 4s. I don't know why he'd ever really be in a position to guard them though.
What even was the rumored deal? The version I heard was meh. According to this article, it was JRich and one of AN/RL for Beasley, and Minnesota said no. They want Smart. For the C's to trade Smart for Beasley, they want a future 1st or Jaden McDaniels included.
edit: Yeah. As an offensive player he'd be a good fit as a microwave type. Far different than an elite 3 and D guy.
Beasley is 2nd in the NBA in 3PA/36 at 11.5. Only Steph Curry is ahead of him.
We want some one who will just let it fly and isn't exposed on D, never mind someone good at it. . Check out this game log. He lets it rain. Last 3 years, he shot .397, 398/1002 from 3. He's also very good from the corner. He's perfectly fine just standing in a corner, shooting 3s. He's shown the ability to score by other means in the past. He's not afraid to shoot. If he's a plus defender, he goes from marginal player to elite 3 and D/fringe all star. That's especially true if he's averaging close to 20 points a game.
Tatum averages 8.4 3PA/G in 36.2 mpg.
Beasley averages 8.3 3PA/G in 26.1 mpg.
He'd probably be starting on the C's and getting close to 10+ 3PA. If he could return to form and hit close to 40% of them, that's 12 points a night on just 3s. Add in another 5 points from 2s and FTs and your at 17. TL/Tatum/Brown/Beasley would be pretty deadly. You have one guy who can clean up the mess with a put back or pass it to the open man for a 3.
18-21 Beasley has some serious gravity. If he weren't starting, he'd give the C's a legit sniper off the bench. Grant and JRich are fine, but they don't have Beasley's presence. Combined, the 2 of them are averaging 7.1 3PA/G, and 10.6 3PA/36. AKA less than Beasley. Beasley has 440 3PA in 1381 minutes. Grant + Richardson have 328 3PA combined in 2220 minutes. I'm trying to think of a Celtics player in recent years who let it fly as much as Beasley. I can come up with Kemba Walker, but he had an entirely different role. Evan Fournier isn't it.
Give that player plus defense and it's on. I'd guess even with plus defense, he's not the most switchable guy. His measurables aren't awful (6'4, 6'7, 8.4'.5) but he's not Romeo (6'4, 7'0, 8'6.5). He would most likely struggle some against some longer 3s and a lot of 4s. I don't know why he'd ever really be in a position to guard them though.
What even was the rumored deal? The version I heard was meh. According to this article, it was JRich and one of AN/RL for Beasley, and Minnesota said no. They want Smart. For the C's to trade Smart for Beasley, they want a future 1st or Jaden McDaniels included.
edit: Yeah. As an offensive player he'd be a good fit as a microwave type. Far different than an elite 3 and D guy.
If THT could be converted into a late first to send to the Lakers in exchange for their unprotected #1 it might be work considering. Because that Lakers squad is pretty bad and they could conceivably end up in that 9/10 game and miss the playoffs.
other team needs to want something to give you something. MIN wants a better defender.
Beyond that....
Beasley is more than 3 years younger, there is a team option on his contract that means you control and extra year.
Also he's a significantly better 3pt shooter and at WAY higher volume. 38% on 7.2 a game last 3 years compared with 35% on 4.3 for Richardson.
He;s a bit better rebounder and turns it over a bit less.
Offensively he's a lot of what Brad wants, a guy who is never afraid to shoot a 3 and drills a lot of them.
If he could keep his head on straight, and learn defense, he does have acceptable size on D, wingspan is on the shorter side compared to the freaks, but he's basically Lu Dort type body not a real short armed guy like Herro or something.
Smart for Beasley and Jaden McDaniels would be hard to pass up. McDaniels has the potential to develop into another guy this team has needed for awhile now. I'm guessing Brad Stevens has done his homework re: off the court issues. They'd also add a rotation player this way. That would open up the possibility of trading Jaden or Grant alongside DS for a point guard or someone like DD if Stevens is so inclined.
Beasley, Jaden, and Donte for Smart, Schroder and Grant.
That would be a completely different team. This is linking 2 rumors together. I wonder if there's a 3 way deal to be had between the Wolves, Bucks and Celtics.
I would pretty quickly pass on that, but I think McDaniels is garabage personally. So to me, you're trading Smart.... who I think is significantly better than Beasley and Grant who I prefer quite a bit to Donte, AND adding a bunch of money longer term (you have to extend Donte before Grant) just for the McDaniels/Schroder swap.
Seems like a harsh take on someone who doesn't turn 22 until September. If you don't like him, the deal doesn't make much sense though. You could also possibly include him with DS to get DD, if that changes your stance any.
then it becomes DS+MS for Beasley and DD.
I don't really like the idea of adding DD either, but I was going with the rumor. I don't think DD makes any sense.
I think DD makes some sense if you can get him cheap. He's the kind of defender they like with some shooting/passing upside. He could be your poor man's Marcus Smart with less passing but league averagish shooting. I see where that player fits in our rotation going forward pretty easily.
Yeah I'm probably harsh on McDaniel, but that's because I think we have a lot of guys already whose only real positives are they are young former 1sts. McDaniel to me is the least interesting of their sub 25 guys, I just don't see any plus skills offensively from him. His whole offensive package is taking and mostly missing 3s.
I'm also probably not THAT high on Beasley. I get the idea behind him, and I think Richardson+ makes some real sense... I think Smart is a better player, even when he was struggling, and Smart that we've seen recently is a LOT better player.
View: https://twitter.com/KeithSmithNBA/status/1491422396599123969
So Smith notes he's been told that along with more non-PG minutes (Richardson/Romeo), the Celtics also expect there to be buyout PGs.
Looking at it I see potential guys being:
Dragic
Bledsoe
Mills
Satoransky
Augustin
Then the less likely ones... Wall, Rose, Kemba, Burks
So Smith notes he's been told that along with more non-PG minutes (Richardson/Romeo), the Celtics also expect there to be buyout PGs.
Looking at it I see potential guys being:
Dragic
Bledsoe
Mills
Satoransky
Augustin
Then the less likely ones... Wall, Rose, Kemba, Burks
If Brad is feeding Keith Smith this "JRich bench PG" stuff then we may just get the
Schroder dumped for Cap relief + 2nd, which would piss me off
You have coaches/teams mixed up...That's the 76ers (Doc) not the Clippers (Ty Lue)
helping the Bucks, 76ers and Bulls would be less than ideal
unless the C's get a good, blocked youngster or a 1st - (and even that may be a questionable move with their recent play)
LOL, man what a brainfart by me.
Not sure I see a fit with PHI.. though a Harden trade might give them a TPE,
Right now what would you want (since you can't get real cap relief) from them... Niang I assume is a quick no.... Springer maybe?
View: https://twitter.com/KeithSmithNBA/status/1491431275596558341
ROOT FOR CHAOS
Actually I think this makes the Nets filthy good and helps PHI, so bad for BOS, but really opens up the deadline once Simmons is settled.
ROOT FOR CHAOS
Actually I think this makes the Nets filthy good and helps PHI, so bad for BOS, but really opens up the deadline once Simmons is settled.
Fwiw, I think that this is lining up nicely for us. Demand for a ballhandler is increasing. The Cs are playing well, so perception about how we have to sell DS may be changing. Not that our tax situation has changed, but Brad can probably sell that Wyc is on board with keeping everyone with our good play lately.
We might get a real offer for DS.
We might get a real offer for DS.
Paul Reed another 76er who some like.
They are hard to solution around, since it is still possible half their roster will be in motion in a Harden deal and separately a Harris deal.
They are hard to solution around, since it is still possible half their roster will be in motion in a Harden deal and separately a Harris deal.
I guess they could do a 3-team trade route
They should just get the Bol or Dozier /OKC salary dump done. They would hold more cards THEN
Hold the Schroder auction (if that's Brad/Wyc's fukn plan)
The EAST is wide open. If Tatum gets his 3pt shooting together this team can beat any of them.
So Bulpett says (https://heavy.com/sports/boston-celtics/dennis-schroder-nba-trade-rumors/) that the Celtics want to move Schroder, but aren't going to full salary dump him, they want something for next year in return.
Also, Windhorst on TV saying the same as Smith, PHI/BKN is getting close, people think they make the deal at some point:
View: https://twitter.com/NBAKrell/status/1491422971592060929
Also, Windhorst on TV saying the same as Smith, PHI/BKN is getting close, people think they make the deal at some point:
View: https://twitter.com/NBAKrell/status/1491422971592060929