Celtics vs. Heat, Round 3 Discussion

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Euclis20

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I know he had a lot of turnovers, but only 12 shots for Tatum in 45 minutes - the last time he had fewer than that Kyrie's last game in Boston, over 3 years ago. That Smart possession was just brutal.

Celtics open game 7 as small favorites (-2.5), which feels right. A lot went right for Miami tonight, I don't think they can do it again unless Herro comes back. The good news is that Boston has really been exceptional on the road so far (6-2 in the playoffs).
 

Eddie Jurak

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Heat came to play.
Celtics had chances and couldn’t convert. Tied with 3 min left at home is a fine spot.

I will preemptively say I am likely a 50/50 chance to get banned from this site after the horseshit EJ is about to spew without repercussion yet again.
I'll join you.
So, how aboiut this, both of you: what rule am I allegedly breaking. ("Without repercussion" is an accusation.) Not allowed to be critical of the home town team when they throw away a playoff game? I thought the main rule around here was not to ad hominen attack other posters. No one has ever said to me "you are breaking rule X" or whatever. Even here, all you do is call for repercussions against me for reasons unstated. I mean, I get you'd rarther I be gone but last time I checked stay on Red Averages good side wasn;t a forum rule.
 

4 6 3 DP

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As angry as I am with that 4th quarter effort, I'd never suggest they don't want it enough or they aren't tough. Because they are. Their brains seen to detach from their bodies at times, that's all. They get careless. But they want it. They are tough. They care. They didn't take it too lightly. Al horford was awful tonight. I don't think it's his heart. He just sucked. Tatum once again couldn't impose his will on the game while Butler did. Not heart. Not effort. Just a couple terrible efforts they couldn't afford against a total stud effort on the other end. If Tatum can impose himself on game 7, we are still going to win this.
 

Red Averages

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The refs were horrific. Not against the Celtics. Just horrific. Sucked the life out of a lot of the game with tickytack calls. Several were flat out wrong - favorable for the Celtics or Heat.
Miami hit several prayers. Butler was incredible. Their role players were incredible. Unfortunately for the Celtics the only role player that dominates was White. You could argue that was Grant + Al’s worst game of the entire year combined. And they were still tied with 3 min left.

Yesterday we spent the day talking about youngest championships for Studs in this league. There is a reason.Vets like Butler or Lowry find a way to get it done.

Now it’s time for the young Celtics to once again prove they don’t have a glass jaw. Jimmy Buler won’t outwill the Celtics. And the Heat won’t blowout the Celtics in a game 7.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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All in all, it was another winnable game the Celtics choked away with their own poor play.

I expect the Heat to win fairly easily on Sunday night, now that Butler has it going again, they will be at home, and if healthy, Miami can be trusted to want it more.
I wonder what you would have written if you were a Heat fan.

TOs didn't really kill thr Cs this game, well at least to the extent that MIA turned the ball over exactly as much and I believe the Cs had more points off TOs.

MIA won the game by shooting 43% from 3P. Give them some credit. If they shoot 43% from 3P in G7, they will have a chance to win it. If they don't, thet have no chance. Plus, they hit some ridiculous shots with the shot clock going off - the Strus 3P on the move; Lowry hit one from the right side; and Butler's turnaround with White contesting. Game is a lot different if those don't go in.

Give MIA some credit.
 

Kenny F'ing Powers

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Why are we even discussing this? The series has been over for days. We've all moved onto Golden State. Heat died after game 5.

Anyone planning any watch parties for Cs/Warriors game 1?
 

greek_gawd_of_walks

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...The Celts should win this series and advance. The memory of The Bubble should still be pretty fresh in their minds and provide plenty of extra motivation to return the favor. I'm cautiously optimistic that they can do that, but Spo scares the shit out of me. The poor ball-handling scares the shit out of me. The health of Rob and Smart, Jimmy's knee feeling miraculously better...
The bolded pretty much all reared its head, minus Rob. Smart clearly was a shell of himself and was bad on both ends. Spo ran circles around Ime. Butler annihilated Tatum, particularly in the second half and fourth quarter where Tatum showed little inclination to "alpha".

For all the posts that were looking forward to the Finals, this was my biggest fear, and it all happened. I have no confidence in this group to win game seven. I'm really thinking this could go the way of game three. Fall behind huge, make a Helter skelter run, lose by six.

This game will haunt the franchise for a long time. A really long time.
 

CaptainLaddie

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I wonder what you would have written if you were a Heat fan.

TOs didn't really kill thr Cs this game, well at least to the extent that MIA turned the ball over exactly as much and I believe the Cs had more points off TOs.

MIA won the game by shooting 43% from 3P. Give them some credit. If they shoot 43% from 3P in G7, they will have a chance to win it. If they don't, thet have no chance. Plus, they hit some ridiculous shots with the shot clock going off - the Strus 3P on the move; Lowry hit one from the right side; and Butler's turnaround with White contesting. Game is a lot different if those don't go in.

Give MIA some credit.
EJ has proven he just hates watching this Celtics team. Ignore him.
 

Light-Tower-Power

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I thought Butler and Lowry were DOA. Neither of them had an ounce of lift on Wednesday and looked both tired and hurt. They completely turned it around tonight. Guess you just have to tip your cap and move on to Sunday.
 

Red Averages

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EJ has proven he just hates watching this Celtics team. Ignore him.
No mention of the Patriots, where EJ asked if Bill Bellichick was losing his fastball before a huge Pats run during the year that had them as the #1 seed with a rookie QB? I’m sure this post will get reported by EJ too. You know; glassjaw and all. This poster is the Dan Shaunessey of SoSH. They get more excited in the negativity than the whole point of sports - the coming together to experience something great - like a 24 and 25 year old establishing a dynasty. Or a GOAT coach/GM on a 20 year run.
 

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So, how aboiut this, both of you: what rule am I allegedly breaking. ("Without repercussion" is an accusation.) Not allowed to be critical of the home town team when they throw away a playoff game? I thought the main rule around here was not to ad hominen attack other posters. No one has ever said to me "you are breaking rule X" or whatever. Even here, all you do is call for repercussions against me for reasons unstated. I mean, I get you'd rarther I be gone but last time I checked stay on Red Averages good side wasn;t a forum rule.
I think you're really good in V&N

Your over the top reactionary bullshit here just doesn't add anything to productive discussion. Sort of like SJH on the Main Board. They didn't embarrass everyone who has ever put on the uniform, rooted for the team, or picked a clover. The result was disappointing and somewhat surprising, but a lot went into that. There are ways to be critical of the team when they win or when they lose that can foster discussion, which I thought is what was supposed to happen here. Your posts do not do this. But they don't break any rule, other than perhaps "don't suck."
 

Ed Hillel

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I thought Butler and Lowry were DOA. Neither of them had an ounce of lift on Wednesday and looked both tired and hurt. They completely turned it around tonight. Guess you just have to tip your cap and move on to Sunday.
It makes no sense, especially Butler. Does that mean he wasn’t hurt and was just terrible last 2 games? Maybe he got a shot or something? So, so weird.

Lowry still looks slow to me, but somehow he made all those shots. I thought Spo was crazy for sticking with him. Guess not.
 

radsoxfan

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I blame the black jerseys. Can we wear the traditional home whites just one time...

Honestly that was a crazy game, between Butler and the insane 30 ft 3s, we should just be glad that wasn't game 7.
 

Eddie Jurak

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As angry as I am with that 4th quarter effort, I'd never suggest they don't want it enough or they aren't tough. Because they are. Their brains seen to detach from their bodies at times, that's all. They get careless. But they want it. They are tough. They care. They didn't take it too lightly. Al horford was awful tonight. I don't think it's his heart. He just sucked. Tatum once again couldn't impose his will on the game while Butler did. Not heart. Not effort. Just a couple terrible efforts they couldn't afford against a total stud effort on the other end. If Tatum can impose himself on game 7, we are still going to win this.
As to the bolded. To me, part of "wanting it," part of toughness, is not getting careless. I don't think they show up disinterested in the game, take the Heat for granted, or any of that stuff. I think that their effort often fails to reach the part where they, to borrow a phrase, "do their jobs."
 

ElUno20

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I think butler was trying to buy time and maybe steal a game until he had to go full out. But there's no more time left to steal.

Same with Herro. He probably couldve gone today.
 

Eddie Jurak

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No mention of the Patriots, where EJ asked if Bill Bellichick was losing his fastball before a huge Pats run during the year that had them as the #1 seed with a rookie QB? I’m sure this post will get reported by EJ too. You know; glassjaw and all. This poster is the Dan Shaunessey of SoSH. They get more excited in the negativity than the whole point of sports - the coming together to experience something great - like a 24 and 25 year old establishing a dynasty. Or a GOAT coach/GM on a 20 year run.
I honestly don't think I've ever reported you. But you have now reached back to a thread I started over 6 months ago in a different forum to attack me here.
EJ has proven he just hates watching this Celtics team. Ignore him.
I guess attacking posters rather than posts is OK, at least when it is me.
 

Jed Zeppelin

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My major bitch about the refs isn't even on the court. It's off it. The Heat bench -- Markieff Morris, specifically -- is on the court EVERY PLAY. Usually it's 2-3 guys, but Morris is ALWAYS on the court. It's ridiculous, limits how the Celtics can play, and it's such an easy tech to call.
A Celtic needs to come off a screen over there with arms/elbows out and draw contact.
 

nighthob

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I get that you like the odds of Butler shooting 3s, but you don't have to make them absolutely easy shots. It's a shame they wasted a brillian performance from Derrick White. While he had some nice plays, this was not a great Smart game. Hard to understand how they couldn't get Tatum the ball more.
They weren’t absolutely easy shots. In a normal game those eight shots produce 3 or 6 points.
 

djbayko

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My major bitch about the refs isn't even on the court. It's off it. The Heat bench -- Markieff Morris, specifically -- is on the court EVERY PLAY. Usually it's 2-3 guys, but Morris is ALWAYS on the court. It's ridiculous, limits how the Celtics can play, and it's such an easy tech to call.
I said this in the game thread. I don't know if space makes this possible, but they almost need a line about 6 inches off the out of bounds line. If a player steps over it while the ball is in the half court, it's an automatic T. Make it so that being close to the court - nevermind on it - isn't even an option.
 

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Jason Tatum will simply have to carry this team to a game 7 win on Sunday. He needs to do what Jimmy Butler did tonight.

This is a huge moment for him. I hope he can step up and deliver.
I keep waiting for him to do it, but he hasn't done it this series. And I think that Miami's game plan is to make sure that he can't
I actually think it's just the opposite. I think they need more balance. Al, Grant, and PP can't have 5 combined points.
 

djbayko

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Heat came to play.
Celtics had chances and couldn’t convert. Tied with 3 min left at home is a fine spot.

I will preemptively say I am likely a 50/50 chance to get banned from this site after the horseshit EJ is about to spew without repercussion yet again.
After the first one or two absurd posts in previous series, I just skip those long posts and save myself the heartburn.
 

The Social Chair

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The refs were horrendous tonight (on both sides), but I wonder if the league sent a memo after the 90s esque Game 5 with the intent to call fouls early to loosen up the game and increase scoring. It worked... kind of.
 

nighthob

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My major bitch about the refs isn't even on the court. It's off it. The Heat bench -- Markieff Morris, specifically -- is on the court EVERY PLAY. Usually it's 2-3 guys, but Morris is ALWAYS on the court. It's ridiculous, limits how the Celtics can play, and it's such an easy tech to call.
I mean seriously, they were all crowding Boston in the corner every possible possession. There were about twenty technicals to be called there.
 

dhellers

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Am I alone in feeling strangely confident they can pull it off on Sunday.
This team just can't make it easy on themselves. Whether its mental lassitude, or lacking a proper balance between aggression and peripheral vision -- when they have some leeway they waste it.

With their backs against the proverbial wall on Sunday, I will not be suprised if they regain these capabilities!
 

Light-Tower-Power

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They weren’t absolutely easy shots. In a normal game those eight shots produce 3 or 6 points.
He’s an odd one. Started his career with no prayer from deep, then became passable, but has completely fallen off a cliff the last few years. I think their contests have been fine. They’re not giving him the Giannis treatment but they’re not running him off the line either. If Jimmy Butler beats you from deep you tip your cap. It is what it is.
 

Light-Tower-Power

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Let the hate flow through you.

View: https://streamable.com/udrur2


View: https://streamable.com/bwxf8r


The amazing thing about that second one is Lowry got up after the supposed offensive foul and continued defending the play. Only after the play ended a few seconds later did Lowry remember to fall back to the ground and contest the non-call through fake injury.
When I talk to friends who don’t like basketball about why they don’t like basketball, they generally point to two things - too many fouls and flopping. 2/2 tonight. Lowry is a disgrace. The falling down everyone does is one thing, but the constant snapping the head back that Lowry does is the lowest of the low. Guy acts like he took a punch from Tyson ten times a game.
 

CaptainLaddie

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I said this in the game thread. I don't know if space makes this possible, but they almost need a line about 6 inches off the out of bounds line. If a player steps over it while the ball is in the half court, it's an automatic T. Make it so that being close to the court - nevermind on it - isn't even an option.
The problem is this limits seats for fans. It’s a money issue.
 

Jed Zeppelin

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This league has guys sitting in the landing zone along the baseline holding hard sharp objects all game they don't give a shit about people being on or near the court.
 

JCizzle

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The refs were horrendous tonight (on both sides), but I wonder if the league sent a memo after the 90s esque Game 5 with the intent to call fouls early to loosen up the game and increase scoring. It worked... kind of.
It was not both sides. The refs were horrendous tonight in favor of the pure trash product that Miami threw on the court tonight. Look to the Lowry flops and the Heat bench images for all the proof anyone needs. The zebras blew this game more than the C's did. It's easy to get turnovers when you can play rugby and the other team operates under a different set of standards. It was certainly worth the margin of victory and then some.
 

reggiecleveland

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DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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There aren't many obvious adjustments for game seven. Hopefully Horford and Smart are capable of giving more offensively. Granite as well. This series has been such a physical battle.

White was amazing on offense but Butler was cooking him repeatedly. They need to solve that because the Heat will gladly take that outcome.

It will be a surprise if the others (ex- Tatum and Brown) don't play better in game seven given their recent resiliency.
 

Ed Hillel

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I think Ime playing Al over Timelord in the 4th was a pretty significant mistake. The D was collapsing on Tatum and Brown, and falling off Williams, who feasted in the 3rd. Williams was also a better option defensively, they really needed his length to help on Butler and closing on 3s. Al made a single 3 and Ime changed his mind, I guess. Seemed like a pretty odd decision, Al did not play particularly well all game.
 

riboflav

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As I said, he had a game for the ages. 47 points. He came to play tonight, good on him. I love the guy because he's a fucking bully and a tough motherfucker, and he showed out.
And what’s truly sad is he is a guy no one remembers in 20 years. Like seriously. Take that for all that is worth.
 

riboflav

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Miami came to play, the Celtics not so much.

This was a shitty game. The officiating was awful. Plenty of terrible calls against the Celtics, but this game felt like one of those where Miami had plenty to complain about as well.

Once again, the Celtics were a turnoverfest in the first quarter, and, at the same time, they let Miami crash the offensive glass. Endind the quarter down 7, a hole they were just never really able to climb out of.

The rest of the game basically followed the same pattern: Celtics would put together a run of good play to close the deficit, them Miami would bounce back. Celtics would fight back to a near tie/tie/small lead, then make a couple of fucking dumb turnovers or do some other stupid thing, or just let up and allow the Heat to go on a run.

Down the very stretch run of the game, the Heat were 100% able to execute their offense, such as it is, and the Celtics were not. Butler dropped 47.

Tatum and Brown, who had great second quarters, and had 18 points each at the half, were largely missing in action for the whole second half. Tatum scored 30 total, but his 12 second half points were as quiet as they get - and his 7 turnovers could have been the difference in the game.

Brown scored 2 points in the second half - two - and got to the line with the scored tied at 99 and missed both.

The best Celtice in the 4th and in the whole game was Derrick White. He scored 22 on 7-14 shooting. Also 5 assists, 3 steals, 1 block, and unlike most of his teammates, zero turnovers. He scored 8 of the Celtics first 10 points in the 4th, had some key assists, and after Marcus stupidly wasted an offsenive posession, came back with a steal.

Al Horford played his far and away worst game of the playoffs. Got in early foul trouble in the first and second quarters so didn't play a lot. Missed his first 5 shots and shot 1-6 overall. He did have 9 rebounds and 5 assists, but also 3 turnovers. He only really looked good for a 2-3 minute stretch midways throught he fourth where he hit his 3 and had a couple of great assists.

It looked like Ime was about to sub Rob in for Al in the 4th when Al started to get going, and Ime decied to call Rob back - Rob did not play in the 4th. That will be second guessable, as Al didn;t do anything useful over the rest of the game and Rob had scored 10 in the third as the Celtics rediscovered him as a lob threat.

All in all, it was another winnable game the Celtics choked away with their own poor play.

I expect the Heat to win fairly easily on Sunday night, now that Butler has it going again, they will be at home, and if healthy, Miami can be trusted to want it more.
Your write ups which I know you put a lot of time into are I’m sorry I guess just awful.

like you seem not to understand basketball and the nba especially and what Spo did tonight. Like you don’t mention it at all. Like the difference between games. It makes me think you’re a troll and just want to dunk on the Celtics. I’ll be fair what are the three adjustments Spo made? And I’m not saying the Celtics couldn’t overcome them I mean they almost did but I am curious if you could name the obvious three.
 
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riboflav

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I hate to bail out a troll but 1. The Heat changed their WS positioning on offense. 2. The Heat stood well back of the three point line. 3. The Heat changed their personnel to match the more modern game.
 

NomarsFool

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Miami just made some amazing shots. That doesn’t mean they wanted it more or “came to play” more or anything. There must have been a half dozen “I can’t believe that went in shots” on the Miami side. I’m sure Boston had some, too, but it sure didn’t feel like it. In a close game, that can be the difference.

I will say that the “Al just made a 3 so I won’t take him out” decision was just plain stupid. As a coach, your decisions need to be based on something other than what a player did in the last 20 seconds.

I was also pretty frustrated with Grant Williams.
 

Eddie Jurak

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Your write ups which I know you put a lot of time into are I’m sorry I guess just awful.

like you seem not to understand basketball and the nba especially and what Spo did tonight. Like you don’t mention it at all. Like the difference between games. It makes me think you’re a troll and just want to dunk on the Celtics. I’ll be fair what are the three adjustments Spo made? And I’m not saying the Celtics couldn’t overcome them I mean they almost did but I am curious if you could name the obvious three.
Interesting that you chhose to frame this as an attack on me instead of a comment about the game. I mean, you had an opportunity here to say "You're wrong because X, Y, Z," but chose to dunk on me instead. I have never done that to you personally or anyone else I can think of.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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I hate to bail out a troll but 1. The Heat changed their WS positioning on offense. 2. The Heat stood well back of the three point line. 3. The Heat changed their personnel to match the more modern game.
With regard to (3), one of the issues I think is that both JT and JB didn't see a rim protevtor so they kept driving into the lane and turning the ball over. I'm not sure why they didn't shoot over MIA like they did in G5, rather than try to go through them.

I will say that the “Al just made a 3 so I won’t take him out” decision was just plain stupid. As a coach, your decisions need to be based on something other than what a player did in the last 20 seconds.
TL looked like he was in pain at times; I wonder how much that played into Ime's devision.
 

lars10

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Lowry and Strus with a bunch of timely threes throughout the game too. I don’t think we played bad at all but the Heat kept answering.

Enough about the offiicials too. Both teams defended aggressivsly and the fouls were 28-27. The one egregious one was the Tatum push off and they knew it and gave us the make up invisible illegal screen on Strus the very next possession.
That doesn’t make up for it though. It gave our best player another foul.. put in his head that, once again, he can’t be at all aggressive going to the hoop w/o getting called, took two points off the board.. most likely should have been 3 since he was actually fouled etc etc. taking points off the board in a very competitive game matters.
 

TrapperAB

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When I talk to friends who don’t like basketball about why they don’t like basketball, they generally point to two things - too many fouls and flopping. 2/2 tonight. Lowry is a disgrace. The falling down everyone does is one thing, but the constant snapping the head back that Lowry does is the lowest of the low. Guy acts like he took a punch from Tyson ten times a game.
There was a play in the second half (maybe the end of the first?) that encapsulates why Lowry is a histrionic, ref-baiting piece of s#%*.

While playing D, he hooks someone’s forearm (I think it was Grant).

He pulls the player’s hand towards his face/brings his face towards the hand.

Contact is made.

Lowry snaps his head back like he’d been shot by a sniper rifle.

All the ref saw was a hand in Lowry’s face.

Whistle.
 
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lars10

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Why are we even discussing this? The series has been over for days. We've all moved onto Golden State. Heat died after game 5.

Anyone planning any watch parties for Cs/Warriors game 1?
Yet another tedious post. Congratulations.. you win the internet bringing up an argument only you still care about.
 

NomarsFool

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I truly hope Tatums reaction to this game is not that he needs to do more. I would say he played pretty well and didn’t try to beat 3-4 guys by playing hero ball. Unfortunately, the other players didn’t step up (White aside), we had some atrocious play by Smart, and some curious coaching decisions not to play more Rob W. Add that all together with some just amazing shots by Miami and you get a bone crushing loss.