#DFG: Canceling the Noise

Is there any level of suspension that you would advise Tom to accept?


  • Total voters
    208

PBDWake

Member
SoSH Member
May 1, 2008
3,686
Peabody, MA
norm from cheers said:
I happened to catch this interview on D & C with Michael Rosenberg who wrote SI piece mentioning Patriots sending towel boys to spy on opposing teams in the locker room.  He has no credible source.. it's embarrassing these "reporters" can report unsubstantiated gossip or rumor as fact:
http://media.weei.com/a/101075553/michael-rosenberg-of-si-discussed-his-allegations-against-bill-belichick-1-20-15.htm
It's embarassing. I'm like 3 minutes in, and you get this so far:
1:35- Dennis asks him if the accusations of towel boys stealing play sheets is hyperbole, Rosenberg responds with "I think they have done that, and I think I am sure, I am sure, what they have done also was have someone there to make sure nobody else comes in"
2:34- Callahan asks him if he has NFL sources saying it's happened, he responds with "Well, I think there's concerns... [insert random dodging] ...Of course the Patriots will say this is ridiculous. I didn't say this is something they've done."
 

BroodsSexton

Member
SoSH Member
Feb 4, 2006
12,659
guam
Shelterdog said:
 
As does Garner's Modern American Usage.  If anything it's a disputed enough point that basement-dwellers' panties shouldn't get bunched over this.
 
Nobody's "panties are bunched."  It was a joke.  
 
Also, is the lazy locution "panties in a bunch" still acceptable here?  Or is that one of those sexist tropes that the community is trying to stamp out?
 

Leather

given himself a skunk spot
SoSH Member
Jul 18, 2005
28,451
Still makes no sense at all. 
 
Christ, seriously?   That reads like a Marx Brothers prank.
 
"Harpo, you go in and pretend to be a towel boy.  Don't say a word."
"*Honk*"
"I'll stay here and make sure nobody else comes in."
*Honk*"
"I dunno, but acting suspicious shouldn't arouse any suspicions."
 
[Harpo enters, carrying stack of towels]
 
"Hey, what are you doing here?"
"*Honk Honk*" 
"The TOWEL BOY, eh?  Hey, are you really sent here to SPY?"
"*Honk*"
"Well...Ok, then.  I'll believe you."
 

Koufax

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
5,946
PBDWake said:
It's embarassing. I'm like 3 minutes in, and you get this so far:
1:35- Dennis asks him if the accusations of towel boys stealing play sheets is hyperbole, Rosenberg responds with "I think they have done that, and I think I am sure, I am sure, what they have done also was have someone there to make sure nobody else comes in"
2:34- Callahan asks him if he has NFL sources saying it's happened, he responds with "Well, I think there's concerns... [insert random dodging] ...Of course the Patriots will say this is ridiculous. I didn't say this is something they've done."
I think the "I think they've done that" was referring to opposing coaches locking the doors.  He wasn't expressing an opinion as to whether towel boys have stolen game plans or play sheets.
 

Leather

given himself a skunk spot
SoSH Member
Jul 18, 2005
28,451
And, once again, without taking a sampling of how every team locks/unlocks doors at every other facility, it's fucking meaningless.  
 
"You know, when teams play New England, the coaches often cover their mouths with their playsheets when calling in the plays.  I know they do that there."
 

PBDWake

Member
SoSH Member
May 1, 2008
3,686
Peabody, MA
Koufax said:
I think the "I think they've done that" was referring to opposing coaches locking the doors.  He wasn't expressing an opinion as to whether towel boys have stolen game plans or play sheets.
Fair enough. It's just a ridiculous article with no credible sourcing, and he brings up the whole Goodell destroyed the tapes thing again. CBS actually did a pretty solid takedown, with something I'd completely forgotten about the whole Spygate thing.


The most forgotten part of the “SpyGate scandal” is the fact that Goodell played the videos on a loop for reporters at the press conference when he announced his punishment. The reporters got to watch the footage on a loop prior to Goodell’s stepping to the podium. (I will always remember this, because the NFL Network’s Rich Eisen cracked one of the better jokes in sports TV history. It was, essentially, “This is the first time ever that a journalist is watching a video in a hotel but doesn’t have to pay $9.99 an hour for it.” What a line, Rich.)
http://boston.cbslocal.com/2015/01/20/sports-illustrated-writer-takes-belichick-cheating-accusations-to-new-absurd-levels/
 
But yeah, the amount of times he says "I don't know what they do and what they don't do"? You don't write the fucking article if that's what you think.
 

dcmissle

Deflatigator
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Aug 4, 2005
28,269
Ever hear of pissing against the wind? That's what we have been doing since 2007. There is no changing the narrative because it drives traffic and serves people with axes to grind.

So as I said yesterday with reference to the Raiders, embrace your inner gangsta. It's more fun and will drive them crazy.
 

BroodsSexton

Member
SoSH Member
Feb 4, 2006
12,659
guam
drleather2001 said:
And, once again, without taking a sampling of how every team locks/unlocks doors at every other facility, it's fucking meaningless.  
 
"You know, when teams play New England, the coaches often cover their mouths with their playsheets when calling in the plays.  I know they do that there."
 
This is a hilarious interview.  Talking about the video screen "it was mentioned to me by people in the league...but it's also fair to wonder if video technology has improved over the years so it's not an advantage anymore."  Cross-examination is the engine of truth, yet again...
 

dcmissle

Deflatigator
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Aug 4, 2005
28,269
And, BTW, this should be an enormous embarrassment for Sports Illustrated, which may be the most literate and best magazine of the last 60 years.
 

PBDWake

Member
SoSH Member
May 1, 2008
3,686
Peabody, MA
God, they're bringing up the whole substitution thing, and how he thinks the Ravens had no time, yadda yadda yadda, and how Peter King tracked the time between the announcement and the snap, and that the Ravens had 7-10 seconds from the announcement to the snap each time, and Rosenberg just goes "Really?" and sounds defeated. This is an embarrassment.
 

Smiling Joe Hesketh

Throw Momma From the Train
Moderator
SoSH Member
May 20, 2003
35,912
Deep inside Muppet Labs
PBDWake said:
God, they're bringing up the whole substitution thing, and how he thinks the Ravens had no time, yadda yadda yadda, and how Peter King tracked the time between the announcement and the snap, and that the Ravens had 7-10 seconds from the announcement to the snap each time, and Rosenberg just goes "Really?" and sounds defeated. This is an embarrassment.
 
In the article Rosenberg claimed that the Pats were running a hurry-up offense during the sequence where they were having guys report as ineligible...which isn't true.
 

Shelterdog

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Feb 19, 2002
15,375
New York City
dcmissle said:
Ever hear of pissing against the wind? That's what we have been doing since 2007. There is no changing the narrative because it drives traffic and serves people with axes to grind.

So as I said yesterday with reference to the Raiders, embrace your inner gangsta. It's more fun and will drive them crazy.
 
Then there's the fact that getting the ball the way you want it is simple gamesmanship.  If a deflated ball is easier to use on a cold rainy day, why not inflate all the ball to the bare minimum of 12.5 for inspection, knowing that the pressure will drop in the cold? Isn't that just being smarty? Isn't that something the Colts and super-duper smart Stanford guy Andrew Luck could have done for their own balls if they wanted to?
 

BroodsSexton

Member
SoSH Member
Feb 4, 2006
12,659
guam
"Where's the circumvention, Michael?"  
 
I love how they keep referring to him by his first name. 
 
"I don't make things up, okay?"
"Who told you about the locks?"
"I'm not getting into that."
"I gotta be honest, I think you're making this stuff up....Do you believe any of it?"
 

Smiling Joe Hesketh

Throw Momma From the Train
Moderator
SoSH Member
May 20, 2003
35,912
Deep inside Muppet Labs
This is a paragraph by paragraph rebuttal to Rosenberg:
 
 
“Technically, what Belichick suggested is legal. [Referee Bill] Vinovich OK’d it. But the key to the plan was what Belichick did not say. He did not say he would hurry up his offense when he declared certain receivers ineligible, giving the Ravens no time to adjust to the tactic. The Ravens barely had time to see who was eligible before the ball was snapped. The officials couldn’t even get into proper position. They allowed the ball to be snapped too quickly.”
 
This is simply false. I was at the game; I presume Rosenberg was not. Had Rosenberg actually been at this game and known what he was talking about, he would not have written this inaccurate description of what took place. (Oh, who am I kidding? He would have written the inaccurate description no matter what.)
 
Despite John Harbaugh’s complaints, and despite Rosenberg’s assessment, the Patriots did not run a hurry-up on the drive when they swapped out a lineman for a running back or tight end. Instead, Josh Kline jogged to the sidelines, and Shane Vereen jogged on. Vereen approached the referee, declared himself ineligible, the referees announced it, the Patriots huddled and then went to the line. The ineligible receiver had been announced; the Ravens weren’t smart enough to leave him alone. Instead, they left Michael Hoomanawanui (a very eligible receiver) wide open. The play was so successful that the Patriots ran it two more times — once with Hoomanawanui as the ineligible guy, and once more with Vereen.
 
On the second time Vereen was used as the ineligible receiver, Vinovich actually announced, “Number 34 has been declared ineligible. Do not cover number 34.” The referee actually told the defense which player they shouldn’t cover. Yet the Ravens still covered him!
 

PBDWake

Member
SoSH Member
May 1, 2008
3,686
Peabody, MA
Smiling Joe Hesketh said:
 
In the article Rosenberg claimed that the Pats were running a hurry-up offense during the sequence where they were having guys report as ineligible...which isn't true.
He just keeps repeating "I wrote it the way I did for a reason", and talking about "whispers". I mean, I could whisper that Seattle uses its business connections to threaten the families of refs' livelihoods if they don't call games favorably, or tell him that I wear two pairs of socks every game so Rex Ryan can't sense my mood from the pheromones my feet emit from across the way, but it doesn't mean it's true. He won't even admit that he believes the stories are true himself. If you're going to publish it, at least have the balls to stand behind it and say that you believe what you're being told is true. This is worse than a Buzzfeed article.
 

pappymojo

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 28, 2010
6,684
dcmissle said:
And, BTW, this should be an enormous embarrassment for Sports Illustrated, which may be the most literate and best magazine of the last 60 years.
 
http://mmqb.si.com/2014/07/29/jordan-gross-weight-retirement-panthers/2/
 


There is one other thing I did not write or refer to, and that is the other videotape the NFL and some Ravens officials have seen, from the security camera inside the elevator at the time of the physical altercation between Rice and his fiancée. I have heard reports of what is on the video, but because I could not confirm them and because of the sensitivity of the case, I never speculated on the video in my writing, because I don’t think it is fair in an incendiary case like this one to use something I cannot confirm with more than one person. I cannot say any more, because I did not see the tape. I saw only the damning tape of Rice pulling his unconscious fiancée out of the elevator.
 

Ed Hillel

Wants to be startin somethin
SoSH Member
Dec 12, 2007
44,223
Here
norm from cheers said:
I happened to catch this interview on D & C with Michael Rosenberg who wrote SI piece mentioning Patriots sending towel boys to spy on opposing teams in the locker room.  He has no credible source.. it's embarrassing these "reporters" can report unsubstantiated gossip or rumor as fact:
http://media.weei.com/a/101075553/michael-rosenberg-of-si-discussed-his-allegations-against-bill-belichick-1-20-15.htm
 
Wow, he actually said that the Patriots get a "favorable schedule" because he's "really close with Roger Goodell?"
 
Holy shit.
 
Edit - He = Kraft
 

PBDWake

Member
SoSH Member
May 1, 2008
3,686
Peabody, MA
Serious question: Does Sports Illustrated have an ombudsman? For all the shit I give ESPN, it is nice that they have one to address this sort of thing when it happens.
 

Leather

given himself a skunk spot
SoSH Member
Jul 18, 2005
28,451
I love how he put "ineligible" in quotes, as if it's some cryptic term that Bill throws around to confuse people.
 

CoffeeNerdness

Member
SoSH Member
Jun 6, 2012
8,872
Well, I now know who Michael Rosenberg is, which is exactly what the guy wanted when he wrote the article.
 

JohnnyK

Member
SoSH Member
May 8, 2007
1,941
Wolfern, Austria
Devizier said:
 
Supposedly the announcers mentioned that during the broadcast of the Patriots-Packers game.
This tweet mentions it, and judging by the timestamp it should be about 2 hours after kickoff:
https://twitter.com/travon/status/539198014188163072
 
Anyone know if there is a play-by-play that also lists time of day? I really want the Packers to lose multiple draft picks too.
 

ivanvamp

captain obvious
Jul 18, 2005
6,104
PBDWake said:
It's embarassing. I'm like 3 minutes in, and you get this so far:
1:35- Dennis asks him if the accusations of towel boys stealing play sheets is hyperbole, Rosenberg responds with "I think they have done that, and I think I am sure, I am sure, what they have done also was have someone there to make sure nobody else comes in"
2:34- Callahan asks him if he has NFL sources saying it's happened, he responds with "Well, I think there's concerns... [insert random dodging] ...Of course the Patriots will say this is ridiculous. I didn't say this is something they've done."
 
This is fit for the Comedy channel, not any remotely serious news or sports reporting.
 

Harry Hooper

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Jan 4, 2002
34,615
Smiling Joe Hesketh said:
 
Not bad, though he whiffed completely on the reality that there are no longer defensive signals to steal. He's right about the "Carson Palmer" rule. The play on which Pollard zapped Brady's knee was already illegal under the existing rules, as Vince Wilfork had been penalized (and maybe even fined?) for diving into a QB's knee a season or two prior. However, the rule was tweaked a bit after Brady's injury to further protect QB's.
 

mascho

Kane is Able
SoSH Member
Nov 30, 2007
14,952
Silver Spring, Maryland
JohnnyK said:
This tweet mentions it, and judging by the timestamp it should be about 2 hours after kickoff:
https://twitter.com/travon/status/539198014188163072
 
Anyone know if there is a play-by-play that also lists time of day? I really want the Packers to lose multiple draft picks too.
 
It is at 13:57 of the 3rd quarter. Lasts about two plays. Just listened to it.
 
EDIT: I'm recording the clip now with audio and will post in a moment.
 

Boston Brawler

Member
SoSH Member
Jan 17, 2011
9,781
Mark Schofield said:
 
It is at 13:57 of the 3rd quarter. Lasts about two plays. Just listened to it.
 
EDIT: I'm recording the clip now with audio and will post in a moment.
Never doubt the power of this place.
 

mascho

Kane is Able
SoSH Member
Nov 30, 2007
14,952
Silver Spring, Maryland
Shelterdog said:
Seriously tweet this to every football reporter you can. It just takes the air out of this whole controversy.
JohnnyK said:
Do you have a source for that? Google only finds other threads about the Pats where this is mentioned but not an original quote or video.
Boston Brawler said:
Is there footage of this online anywhere?
Yeah, here's the video with audio:



http://vid809.photobucket.com/albums/zz11/mascho030916/Football%20Central/ScreenCaptureProject295.mp4

And I like how at the outset Nantz touts Simms as the guy behind tinkering with the football. Simms also mentions how the officials check the footballs.

Can't believe I spent 20 minutes on this, but whatever. I'll sit back and wait for the outrage headed Green Bay's way...
 

GregHarris

beware my sexy helmet/overall ensemble
SoSH Member
Jun 5, 2008
3,460
Michael Rosenburg is coming across sounding like Saul, after D&C ripped him a new one.
 

Shelterdog

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Feb 19, 2002
15,375
New York City
Mark Schofield said:
Yeah, here's the video with audio:
 
http://vid809.photobucket.com/albums/zz11/mascho030916/Football%20Central/ScreenCaptureProject295.mp4
 
And I like how at the outset Nantz touts Simms as the guy behind tinkering with the football. Simms also mentions how the officials check the footballs. 
 
Can't believe I spent 20 minutes on this, but whatever. I'll sit back and wait for the outrage headed Green Bay's way...
 
Seriously tweet this to every football reporter you can.  It just takes the air out of this whole controversy.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

Member
SoSH Member
Jan 23, 2009
20,932
Maine
Mark Schofield said:
Yeah, here's the video with audio:
 
http://vid809.photobucket.com/albums/zz11/mascho030916/Football%20Central/ScreenCaptureProject295.mp4
 
And I like how at the outset Nantz touts Simms as the guy behind tinkering with the football. Simms also mentions how the officials check the footballs. 
 
Can't believe I spent 20 minutes on this, but whatever. I'll sit back and wait for the outrage headed Green Bay's way...
 
Thanks for the effort, much appreciated.  Perhaps it's Green Bay fans that should be outraged about Rodgers wanting over-inflated balls.  If he deflated them like the Patriots everyone else, maybe the Packers would still be playing.
 

SMU_Sox

queer eye for the next pats guy
SoSH Member
Jul 20, 2009
8,969
Dallas
Guys, a character in a movie said it best. This is from Bullet-tooth Tony in Snatch, "You should never underestimate the predictability of stupidity." I have no doubt that there will be a lot of idiots coming out of the wood-work (and mainstream prominent idiots) who have an ax to grind. I've lost the ability to get riled up over this crap because I've heard it so much I just don't care.
 

dcmissle

Deflatigator
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Aug 4, 2005
28,269
Well, I now know who Michael Rosenberg is, which is exactly what the guy wanted when he wrote the article.
Yes. As big as we think the NFL is, apart from one offs like an NFL player killing someone or beating up his GF on tape, this is the only time of year when it captures the attention of pure news outfits. Just scroll up to this thread to early evening yesterday.

So he is absolutely out to make a name for himself, hoping to parlay this into interviews on the cable networks at least and maybe more. And because news people have difficulty parsing what's legit and what isn't, he'll have the reputation of SI at his back. Even though a lot of the stuff he points out, if it happened, happened 50 years ago, when guys like George Allen and Al David were doing it and bitching about it.

Perfect storm. The NFL media guys and Goodell are in a spot.
 

Slow Rheal

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Oct 29, 2001
1,780
Maine
Mark Schofield said:
Yeah, here's the video with audio:
 
http://vid809.photobucket.com/albums/zz11/mascho030916/Football%20Central/ScreenCaptureProject295.mp4
 
And I like how at the outset Nantz touts Simms as the guy behind tinkering with the football. Simms also mentions how the officials check the footballs. 
 
Can't believe I spent 20 minutes on this, but whatever. I'll sit back and wait for the outrage headed Green Bay's way...
 
Thanks a ton, Mark - awesome stuff as usual. I don't comment a lot in BBTL, but really appreciate all that you guys do, like this - which is fantastic.
 

DaughtersofDougMirabelli

Member
SoSH Member
Jan 17, 2006
3,016
Mark Schofield said:
Yeah, here's the video with audio:
 
http://vid809.photobucket.com/albums/zz11/mascho030916/Football%20Central/ScreenCaptureProject295.mp4
 
And I like how at the outset Nantz touts Simms as the guy behind tinkering with the football. Simms also mentions how the officials check the footballs. 
 
Can't believe I spent 20 minutes on this, but whatever. I'll sit back and wait for the outrage headed Green Bay's way...
 
Awesome stuff Mark.
 
edit: I tweeted it to Mike Reiss, he's already acknowledged it. 
 

Leather

given himself a skunk spot
SoSH Member
Jul 18, 2005
28,451
The Rodgers stuff is good and fine, but the best thing is still for someone to confirm that the Patriots did not tamper with the balls.
 
Falling back on "Well, other guys do it too!" feels like admitting that the Patriots did something wrong.
 

BroodsSexton

Member
SoSH Member
Feb 4, 2006
12,659
guam
drleather2001 said:
The Rodgers stuff is good and fine, but the best thing is still for someone to confirm that the Patriots did not tamper with the balls.
 
Falling back on "Well, other guys do it too!" feels like admitting that the Patriots did something wrong.
 
The problem is that it's difficult to conclusively prove a negative proposition, to the satisfaction of conspiracy-theorists.  What this video shows is that the whole thing is bullshit and incidental.
 

pappymojo

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 28, 2010
6,684
Shelterdog said:
 
Seriously tweet this to every football reporter you can.  It just takes the air out of this whole controversy.
 
Can this go on to the SOSH Central site instead?  Reiss is great, but it grinds my gears that someone else is going to get credit for finding this. 
 

DJnVa

Dorito Dawg
SoSH Member
Dec 16, 2010
54,198
Mark Schofield said:
Yeah, here's the video with audio:
 
http://vid809.photobucket.com/albums/zz11/mascho030916/Football%20Central/ScreenCaptureProject295.mp4
 
And I like how at the outset Nantz touts Simms as the guy behind tinkering with the football. Simms also mentions how the officials check the footballs. 
 
Can't believe I spent 20 minutes on this, but whatever. I'll sit back and wait for the outrage headed Green Bay's way...
 
That's awesome. I tweeted it out, specifically to Mike Freeman, but everyone should do the same.
 
EDIT: Freeman seems interested but says audio is not working.
 

Leather

given himself a skunk spot
SoSH Member
Jul 18, 2005
28,451
BroodsSexton said:
 
The problem is that it's difficult to conclusively prove a negative proposition, to the satisfaction of conspiracy-theorists.  What this video shows is that the whole thing is bullshit and incidental.
 
You really think that is going to sate the mouth breathers?
 
I mean, nothing will, but I think without the league first saying "This was a non issue", the Rodgers stuff just allows the goalposts to move to "Well, this was a playoff game/ Patriots are multiple offenders/ Rodgers was upfront about it and not sneaky/ etc..."
 

GregHarris

beware my sexy helmet/overall ensemble
SoSH Member
Jun 5, 2008
3,460
Bonus points if it was the same arm he got a personal foul with.
 

Leather

given himself a skunk spot
SoSH Member
Jul 18, 2005
28,451
Mark Schofield said:
And Volin just put it out there.
 
I think we're done here people. Let's start talking about football. 
 
Until this Keystone Kops league definitively states that no discipline or penalty is forthcoming, we're not done.  
 
And Volin mentioning it is fine, but until the national media start walking it back, what the Boston media say is irrelevant as far as public perception goes.
 
EDIT: Good work with getting it out there, though.